[Pamito]

Hi all. I post a bit in the antipsychotics area, but I have an issue that I want to see if anyone else has and can understand.

I've had schizoaffective disorder for almost 20 years, I'm 35.
When I was younger I was very unwell but I still could read, think on a deep level, complete university, work.

I finished a degree a few years ago, with relapses two or three times a year. Then after one relapse, I just didn't get my brain back. I am now relatively sane, but I am unable to think deeply about things, to really understand reality, I have little motivation, and I don't have the same interests that I had when I was well. I can't read, understand complex films, am not interested in socializing, or dating, or anything but hanging out at home and watching TV or playing playstation.

Has anyone had this happen to them? I am like a shell of my former self, and I have lost many of the things that make a person's life full. Does it come back? Or have I sort of short circuited my brain from many years of schizoaffective disorder? I want to be the 'whole' me, but it is not there to access!!

I didn't write this to rant, just to see if anyone has experienced it. I would be interested to know what others' experiences are on this; I have always bounced back from episodes, but its been a few years now....so I'm worried.

[SashaSue]

Some of what you're talking about could also be connected to your meds, depending what you're taking. It's at least worth discussing with your pdoc. Or you could be depressed, there's always that possibility.

This post has been edited by SashaSue: 21 November 2009 - 03:37 PM

[firefly01]

What your experiencing kind of sounds like negative symptoms of schizophrenia. Like you mentioned lack of motivation ect. But I'm not a pdoc so I can't tell you that this is what you have. Sasha is right to that it could be med related. I'd talk to your pdoc about this and see what they can do.

[buddha443556]

I had a very gradual on-set, I've probably been losing things, skills, knowledge for years without ever realizing it. When I was young I was a genius (IQ 164) but these days I can barely think. I sure the hell can't argue anymore ... check the political forum! I've always been schizoid however when I was younger I could fake being human. I was actually the person other people came to for advice and with their troubles. Now I can barely get through a doctor visit without the urge to kill the SOB ... probably not the doctor but the illusions and intrusive violent thoughts. It's like I've lost so much that I can't cope anymore. I look at any of mathematics books that line my walls and wonder WTF does this shit mean! At one time, I could quote the equations from memory and solve them with no trouble.

Thanks to apathy, I just don't give a shit about anything ... time to take my meds oh joy.

[FireBird]

It seems you are describing both negative and cognitive symptoms and that is associated with your schizoaffective disorder. This is very common. I don't know if meds really fix that part as they are usually more for the positive symptoms.

[Pamito]

Thanks so much everyone for your replies.

I think it is cognitive and negative symptoms, and am trying to fix it with extra meds. Just saw my Pdoc and adding in 2.5 zyprexa with my seroquel. I still have hope that it is something that meds can fix.

I guess lowered functioning is something that happens with these illnesses. To me, there is so much more to schizophrenia than postitive symptoms. They are the most easy for the outside observer to quantify and diagnose, but for me, at least, its the little deficits like poverty of thought that are the most difficult to live with.

I really appreciate all your replies, as I don't know many other people with sz.

Now I will either be feeling a lot better in a week, or be eating everything in the house

[Mckey]

When I explain "positive" and "negative" symptoms of Schizophrenia I say "positive is what you gain" and "negative is what is taken away". And isnt that the truth? What you describe does sound like negative/cognitive symptoms of Schizophrenia. Personally I found no meds to help with the negative symptoms. I wish you luck in that journey, and if you find something let me know!

[Pamito]

Mckey, on 23 November 2009 - 02:22 PM, said:

When I explain "positive" and "negative" symptoms of Schizophrenia I say "positive is what you gain" and "negative is what is taken away". And isnt that the truth? What you describe does sound like negative/cognitive symptoms of Schizophrenia. Personally I found no meds to help with the negative symptoms. I wish you luck in that journey, and if you find something let me know!

I like your way of explaining pos and neg symptoms, its really good.

Usually a good med would take care of these symptoms for me, so it's worth trying. When I tried geodon a few weeks back, it was like a lightbulb in my brain switching on, so I know that meds can help this, unfortunately i got horrible akathisia so I had to stop it. Its hard to tell what are med-controllable symptoms and what are long-term deficits....I hope these issues are the former.

[Stacia]

Hi. You sound like me. I spent a few very tough years before I was diagnosed with bipolar followed by two more with bad symptoms as we tried to find meds that would work. Once we did find a cocktail that helped a lot, my brain was still checked out. Whether it was on loan to someone else or just missing in action, it clearly was not all there in my skull. My executive function was broken. Figure out sequences, planning, and so forth was impaired. My language skills sucked. I could not read for more than a few minutes. I could not retain much new info/activity (where I put stuff, etc) or remember much old stuff. I felt cognitively decapitated. Two things happened over time. One was that I realized these impairments were worse when I was having symptoms, even small ones. The other is that time actually does heal a broken brain. It's been about a year now. I sat thru a whole movie the other day. First time in years. I think I might be ready to try a novel again since I can read for longer periods. My memory has improved. I doubt that it will ever be what it once was but it's in the realm of normal now which feel so good.

I think it's not likely that a single episode broke you brain. More likely that you need time for you brain to recover. Possibly you have some depressive symptoms going on, too. Those can definitely effect cognition and motivation. If you brain is in recovery mode, I'd guess that the depressive symptoms don't have to be spectacular to compound the problem. Depending how long you've been on your current meds, you might also need time to adjust. There are many possibilities that have positive outcomes. Don't give up.

[OscillateWildly]

Pamito, on 22 November 2009 - 09:37 PM, said:

Thanks so much everyone for your replies.

I think it is cognitive and negative symptoms, and am trying to fix it with extra meds. Just saw my Pdoc and adding in 2.5 zyprexa with my seroquel. I still have hope that it is something that meds can fix.

I guess lowered functioning is something that happens with these illnesses. To me, there is so much more to schizophrenia than postitive symptoms. They are the most easy for the outside observer to quantify and diagnose, but for me, at least, its the little deficits like poverty of thought that are the most difficult to live with.

I really appreciate all your replies, as I don't know many other people with sz.

Now I will either be feeling a lot better in a week, or be eating everything in the house

I've read that the negative symptoms are the most debilitating, as they prevent sufferers from returning (or entering) the world and functioning even when psychosis is controlled.

Or they might not be negative symptoms at all, they might just be med related.
Meds for psychosis can exacerbate those symptoms as they lower energy and motivation. Unless the problem is related to positive symptoms/psychosis I would question your drs decision to ADD another sedating antipsychotic like zyprexa. That is going to make you more flat and apathetic.

I would ask your doctor if he could put you on an AP that can possibly help with energy or motivation. Seroquel is really sedating, abilify or geodon might be better tolerated.
Even your AD, remeron, is real sedating.
Most people would be pretty zonked and zoned out on that, especially someone with schiz who has any negative symptoms at baseline. Or someone with depression and psychosis (sza)
Or maybe some kind of stimulant or wellbutrin could help with energy and motivation.
But note that either of these interventions could trigger your positive symptoms.

This post has been edited by OscillateWildly: 23 November 2009 - 04:34 AM

[SashaSue]

Geodon and abilify are the two ap's that are usually most effective for treating negative symptoms. If geodon helped, it might be worth trying abilify. Did you consider staying on the geodon, but adding something like cogentin to treat the akathisia?

[Entities]

I myself have noticed my cognition has declined. My English Literature teacher in college wants me to bring in a note from my psychiatrist so I get extra consideration in my exam....I'm not complaining.

[Anelize]

I felt the same way after this last bipolar episode. It lasted for over a year, involved two hospitalizations, and multiple med changes. I felt like I had a stroke. Literally. My brain was broken. I couldn't think, read, maintain a conversation. It took about six months and the right cocktail for things to start to get back to normal. I'm finally getting there, and feel like I'm coping pretty well at work, and at home. For awhile there, I didn't think that I'd be able to work at all. Hang in there.

[Stacia]

Anelize, on 23 November 2009 - 04:35 PM, said:

I felt the same way after this last bipolar episode. It lasted for over a year, involved two hospitalizations, and multiple med changes. I felt like I had a stroke. Literally. My brain was broken. I couldn't think, read, maintain a conversation. It took about six months and the right cocktail for things to start to get back to normal. I'm finally getting there, and feel like I'm coping pretty well at work, and at home. For awhile there, I didn't think that I'd be able to work at all. Hang in there.

I'm glad you are feeling better, Anelize.

[koali777]

I was on 240 mg of Geodon, and I lost cognition too. I found out later I shouldn't have been on that much, but I was put on that when I went into the mental ward. I was also unable to read or to think deeply, and I couldn't even play video games (which are practically my life...it was so strange). I'd just lie around watching TV ALL DAY. Horribly depressing. I was so drugged I couldn't be depressed, but I would have been if I'd realized what was going on. I was taken off of the drug because of these issues. I even had to drop out of school and quit my job since I was a math tutor. Luckily I have all those things back, but it was terrible. I think this may be common for some people.

[SheilaNZachary]

Your post is eerily familiar. I was diagnosed as schizophrenic when I was 50 years old, a bit over three years ago. I received the diagnosis at a geriatic psychiatric hospital where I had been committed against my will. At that time I was recently retired from aI paraprofessional job at a major law school. I worked for 30 years without trouble. I put on makeup every day, dressed nicely, took care of the house, helped care for my elderly parents, worked out at a gym, took yoga . . .

Today, I mostly watch TV and play Yahoo games. My brain capacity definitely seems to be compromised. Mainly, I cannot remember anything. My pdoc sent me for memory testing with a neuropsychologist but he said my testing was normal. Frequently I ask my husband questions about movies or TV shows we are watching because I can't follow what's going on.

As for grooming, I bathe, wash my hair and brush my teeth an average of once per week. I abhor leaving the house (mostly, I think because of the effort grooming requires). I only socialize with my husband, adult children, and immediate family. I cancelled (at the last minute) three appointments with the social worker in a row. She charged me for them and I knew she would but I still didn't go. If it wasn't for guilt, I would never, ever, leave the house. I feel terrible that my husband has to work all day AND do grocery shopping, errands, etc. Also, I feel a lot of guilt that I don't visit my elderly parents often.

On the plus side, I have recently started reading more and really enjoying it. That is better than what I have been doing, although I don't think I retain that much of what I read.

I wish the docs would discover some new miracle drug that put us back the way we used to be.