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D2 Dopamine antagonism: Adderall w/ Antipsychotics


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#1 MatthewMcClintic

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Posted 28 August 2010 - 03:10 PM

What anti-psychotic drug, or drugs won't negate the effects of stimulant medication. Or at least have the least amount of effect on them. I know that their will be new drugs which works on metabotropic glutamate receptor 2 agonism called as of now LY2140023. (Recently found out they work mostly on the negative symptoms and I'm paranoid type.)

I'm currently on Geodon, it causes me anhedonia, dysphoria, and it completely negates any positive effects from my prescribed Adderall medication. I've also seen a decrease in effect from other semi-recreational chemicals. What anti-psychotic could I go on that would have the least amount of effects of my Adderall use. I know Adderall can cause psychosis so please don't lecture.

I have chronic fatigue and I need the Adderall to get out of bed. I've been looking for a chemical supplier for LY2140023 but it's so expensive that it's not feasible for me to try it yet.

Also, I've heard that Cannabidiol works as an atypical anti-psychotic drug. But it's only prescribed along with THC, and not alone or labeled for anti-psychotic use yet.

If i had a medical marijuana license in my state per say, since it's available here: Would it be legal to isolate Cannabidiol my self or have a lab do it for me? I would just smoke it but the THC makes positive symptoms worse for most people i've heard.

I'm looking to Aripiprazole since it's a d2 dopamine partial agonist. But how high is the affinity? Will it alter the effects of my mood, in a positive way rather than dulling me via the d2 d3 dopamine antagonism that Geodon works on.

All these drugs are prescribed to me and none of this is illegal.

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I don't trust psychiatrists, I only go to them so i can have legal access to the medications I need. They don't know anything about prescribing the right set of medications, they must spin a wheel or something to figure out what to prescribe me.

They literally have me on 0.25mg of Klonopin now and when I came to this doctor I was taking 3mg of xanax per day.

I've also realized that the Geodon doesn't let any amount of benzodiazepine effect me.

I guess Geodon means don ( down to ) geo ( earth ). I'm an artist, I don't want to be this down to earth.
I'm half thinking about just dealing with my voices and delusions if i can't find an antipsychotic that doesn't completely screw with me dopamine wise.

Edited by MatthewMcClintic, 28 August 2010 - 03:23 PM.



#2 Aurochs

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Posted 28 August 2010 - 04:17 PM

All antipsychotics currently on the market are D2 antagonists or partial agonists. Research is being done with other mechanisms, but they're several years away from market.

Because all of them bind to D2, they could all potentially affect Adderall. The only way to find out for sure if one does is to try it. There are other people here who take stimulants and antipsychotics together successfully. Abilify can be activating for some people, and sedating for others.

I have chronic fatigue and I need the Adderall to get out of bed. I now have almost no motivation and I'm looking for some sort of high. Can you also take the legal substance 1,4-B while on anti-psychotics? [snip] All these drugs are prescribed to me and none of this is illegal.

1,4-B is not an FDA approved substance, so it's not available by prescription in the US. While it's not specifically scheduled, it may be an illegal chemical analog of GHB. I note that 1,4-B was responsible for the recall of Aqua-Dots a few years ago. But, to answer your question, antipsychotics shouldn't interfere with 1,4-B any more than they would interfere with alcohol. However, the two may have additive effects, especially sedation, and the combination could be very dangerous. I DO NOT ADVISE COMBINING 1,4-B WITH ANY ANTIPSYCHOTIC DRUG.

I need something for recreation and this is killing me. I've been looking for a chemical supplier for LY2140023 but it's so expensive that it's not feasible for me to try it yet.

The only legitimate way to get ahold of drugs that are in preclinical trials is through the FDA. They allow limited access in cases where other drugs have failed and the patient is at high risk. This would have to go through your pdoc, and it's not likely that the FDA will allow it in your case.

Edited by Aurochs, 28 August 2010 - 04:23 PM.

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#3 Aurochs

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Posted 28 August 2010 - 05:34 PM

As a final note, you say you're looking for a "high" and something "for recreation". Drug abuse is not a good way to recover from your illness. It doesn't matter if these drugs are legally obtained or if they're "gray area" substances, you're still looking for a high. Continuing in this manner is only going to make the illness worse.

One of the goals of this forum is to foster a more informed relationship between doctors and patients. Doctors are not godlike figures whose orders should never be questioned, and patients are not mere consumers who should blindly follow their doctors' directions. Mutual respect and communication are the keys to good treatment. So I have to ask you, have you brought any of these concerns up with your pdoc?

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." --Carl Sagan


#4 saveyoursanity

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Posted 28 August 2010 - 05:55 PM

Not going to comment on the desire you expressed for recreational use, except to say that it's highly probable that it's a bad idea.

I'm curious as to how much Adderall you're currently taking.

As it is, I take a low dose of Abilify and a fairly high dose of Adderall to counteract the lack of energy/anhedonia endemic to my depression. 5mgs of Abilify and 60mgs of Adderall IR (over the day). If I weren't taking the abilify, I probably wouldn't need as much adderall, but if I don't take the abilify, my chronic anxiety and obsessive ruminative thinking get far out of hand (trust me, I know).

Edited by saveyoursanity, 28 August 2010 - 05:56 PM.

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#5 Velvet Elvis

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Posted 28 August 2010 - 06:58 PM

I've successfully combined anti-psychotics and stimulants for many years. Part of trick is getting the dose of each right where there's not too much interference. It also means accepting being partiality symptomatic for what each is meant to treat. It can really be a balancing game.

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#6 SashaSue

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Posted 28 August 2010 - 09:50 PM

Yeah, I've been on Adderall with assorted AAP's, and never had an issue. Also, I'm wondering how you know that what sound like depressive symptoms are being caused by Geodon? Especially considering how many people find it activating, I'm wondering if you might not just be depressed. Honestly, your attitude towards doctors makes it not so likely that you're going to hit upon the best med or meds to address your symptoms.
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#7 netsavy006

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Posted 29 August 2010 - 03:17 PM

From what I've read on another forum, if people have to take antipsychotics, i've seen it most common though mileage will vary, they combine either stimulant + abilify or stimulant + geodon.

Like I said, that's based on what users have stated using on other forums for ADHD and whatever 2nd condition they are treating.

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