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cancer from laptop computers?

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Posted

does anyone know of documented cases of people getting cancer from having their laptop computer sitting on their tummy for long periods? i'm just lying here and thinking that i have this pretty intense electromagnectic spectrum generator sitting on top of a lot of organs that are pretty important to me and am wondering if i'm mutating the merry hell out of them by parking my laptop computer there.

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Posted

Grouse, I have no idea, but you just made me laugh thinking about how men used to 'cover' themselves in the vicinity of a microwave...

I don't think electromagnetic fields are all that dangerous unless you happen to have a pace-maker or defibrillator... but then I'm totally not a science geek, so what do I know?

I'm sure someone smarter than me will certainly come along and answer your question.

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Posted (edited)

Grouse,

There is no reliable research to indicate that electromagnetic fields found in house appliances can induce cancer.

Second, there is no known mechanism for them to induce cancer.

Edited by AirMarshall

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Posted

thank you A.M.

that sets my mind at ease.

grouse

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Posted

Grouse, just to be safe, it would probably be a good idea to go ahead and remove any organs you feel may have been compromised so that the cancer doesn't spread. 

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Posted

Hey Grouse,

Amazon42 could always use another velvet spleen! ;)

A.M.

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Posted

does anyone know of documented cases of people getting cancer from having their laptop computer sitting on their tummy for long periods? i'm just lying here and thinking that i have this pretty intense electromagnectic spectrum generator sitting on top of a lot of organs that are pretty important to me and am wondering if i'm mutating the merry hell out of them by parking my laptop computer there.

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Posted

does anyone know of documented cases of people getting cancer from having their laptop computer sitting on their tummy for long periods? i'm just lying here and thinking that i have this pretty intense electromagnectic spectrum generator sitting on top of a lot of organs that are pretty important to me and am wondering if i'm mutating the merry hell out of them by parking my laptop computer there.

Well, all I have is my own story. I have spent countless hours with the laptop on my lap and I recently was diagnosed with endometrial cancer, which is cancer of the uterus. I can't believe, I was always so careful of not living near power lines and thought those who did were fools, and here I go sitting with all that electricity on my gut for years. Anyway...

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Posted

My flatmate got kidney cancer, a few years ago, really rare in someone so young(33) She was too advanced when they discovered it and died in 2004 after 8 months struggle.

My neighbour has recently got the all clear after being diagnosed with bowel cancer aged 27. Amazingly rare in a woman and so young. She recently told me she would often work from home, in bed, with a lap top on her stomach.

And guess what, my flat mate was exactly the same.

After a couple of years of asking why on earth her? This could be the answer.

Totally unproven but both women, both young it seems too much of a coincidence to ignore.

Sorry to be a downer!

J

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Posted

does anyone know of documented cases of people getting cancer from having their laptop computer sitting on their tummy for long periods? i'm just lying here and thinking that i have this pretty intense electromagnectic spectrum generator sitting on top of a lot of organs that are pretty important to me and am wondering if i'm mutating the merry hell out of them by parking my laptop computer there.

I'm currently in treatment for Stage III rectal cancer --- absolutely no familial history of any kind of cancer. Otherwise, very fit & healthy. Many aspects of my health habits (anti-oxidant supplements, statins, low-fat diet, etc.) have been shown to prevent colorectal cancer. However, I've been using a laptop almost every day for past 5 years. In my mind, that is absolutely the culprit!!

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Posted

Karen, I'm sorry you are sick, and hope you recover quickly.

You can rest easy that your computer did NOT cause your cancer. It's a scientific fact. Please read my explanation above.

best,

a.m.

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Posted

Many aspects of my health habits (anti-oxidant supplements, statins, low-fat diet, etc.) have been shown to prevent colorectal cancer.

These things may correlate to a reduced incidence in the overall population, but they have not been proven to prevent colorectal cancer in anyone. For all you know the cancer may well have started before you ever started playing with a laptop.

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Posted

Let me amplify on the the likely causes of cancer:

Given no family history..

The immediate cause of cancer is mutation of a cell, by a change in its DNA. Cells replicate hundreds or thousands of times during our lifetime, and with tens of thousands of bonds, it is a likelihood that errors will eventually occur. Most aren't dangerous, a few are. This is the most likely cause of any cancer.

The occurence of Free Radicals within the cell or its mitochondria due to normal metabolic processes can damage the DNA.

Exposure to chemicals, natural or manmade, naturally occuring in the body or cells, may be a cause.

Exposure to ionizing radiation from various sources:

Cosmic radiation from outside our galaxy

Solar radiation from the sun

Xrays from the dentist or doctors

Radon in the air or water

Gamma radiation from granite countertops, or naturally occuring soils/rocks.

numerous other sources of Gamma, Beta, Alpha radiation

"Electronics are out to get me, right?"

TV's? No. TV's since the mid 1960's present no radiation hazard. (and prior to that it still wasn't the picture tube).

CRT, LCD, LED Monitors are totally safe. So is the wiring in your house.

Electricity has been in use for over 150 years in various forms. No one has shown it scientifically to cause cancers.

a.m. resident radio & electronics technician

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Posted

I have been an electrician for over twenty years. One of my duties as an electrician includes disconnecting and reconnecting electrical services. Most of the time this is done while the utility is still "hot", meaning that the wires are live. As long as certain precautions are taken, i.e., you're not grounded, wear gloves, and you handle conductors one at a time, this can be done safely. I also have done a bunch of troubleshooting on live circuits since that generally is the fastest way to find a fault. I've also been shocked more times than I care to remember.

In short, I have been exposed to very high amounts of electricity for at least the past 20 years, and it hasn't given me cancer. I'm crazy as hell, but other than that, I'm fine.

Karen, I'm really sorry about your health, but as an electrician who deals with high voltage regularly, my opinion is that it couldn't have come from the small amount of emf emitted by a laptop's power supply.

I hope my disagreement doesn't upset you, and I sincerely hope you can beat that monster.

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Posted

I'm no scientist but my theory is that while the electricity may not be the culprit, the heat is. Studies have shown that laptop computers can permanently damage male testicules and cause infertility. I hate the feeling inside when a laptop is on my body...its not the skin that bothers me but the internal organs.

God be with you and may you have a full and complete recovery.

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Posted (edited)

OK, as AirMarshall said, non-ionizing radiation hasn't been shown to be carcinogenic. (Even if one day it turns out to cause cell damage, I'd bet anything that its effects are nothing in comparison to the all the other potentially dangerous things you do everyday--like eating peanut butter* (actual moldy peanuts would be worse, though).

The thing about laptops--and disposable diapers--is that they're suspected to reduce male fertility by keeping the 'nads too warm. (Warm 'nads are known to be bad for male fertility.) But these are just hypotheses; not enough research has been done on them to be able to tell either way.

The one thing we actually know is that boys born in the U.S. grow up to have lousier sperm than boys born abroad (who immigrate to the U.S. at a very young age). That's why disposable diapers are under suspicion. (Most people around the world still use cloth diapers, which don't get as hot; of course that's rapidly changing very rapidly.)

But so many other factors could be responsible for the lousy sperm in U.S.-born men that it's not even funny. Diapers may have something to do with it, they could turn out to be "innocent" just as easily...

*Aflatoxin B1, produced by a fungus that likes to grow on nuts, is one of the most potent carcinogens we know. Granted, the FDA has placed very strict rules on how many aflatoxin molecules can be found in peanut butter, but I doubt that every batch coming out of every peanut butter manufacturer actually gets screened.

Edited by Artemisia

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Posted

*Aflatoxin B1, produced by a fungus that likes to grow on nuts, is one of the most potent carcinogens we know. Granted, the FDA has placed very strict rules on how many aflatoxin molecules can be found in peanut butter, but I doubt that every batch coming out of every peanut butter manufacturer actually gets screened.

Thank you for clarifying which nuts you are speaking of. ;)

And speaking of cancer and nether regions. Did you know the first cause and effect connection of cancer was that of scrotal cancer in London chimney sweeps caused by creosote.

a.m.

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Posted (edited)

Really, you shouldn't use a laptop (despite its name) on your lap or stomach by itself, anyway. You could block the fan underneath, which could cause overheating and damage the computer. I use a lap desk, which keeps the computer steady and allows air to flow underneath.

AirMarshall, thanks for the explanations you gave; some bits are a bit over my head, but it's good to have someone here who's knowledgeable about such things. ;)

Edited by FreedomSeeker

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Posted

Does anyone remember the tight pants theory? Here's a recap (from this site):

The dangers of wearing tight pants:

Lower sperm counts in males, infertility and testicular cancer.

Yeast infections and urinary tract infections in women

Limitation in the mobility of hip joints, causing stretching of joint capsules, and negative affect on the spine.

Too-tight waist constricts the abdominal area filled with vital organs, causing problems such as reduced lymph flow from the pelvis, improper immune system function and poor circulation.

Wearing "low riders" or "hip huggers" might result in compression of nerves, which leads to a burning and tingling feeling in the legs.

Yikes! I'm lying here, laptop on belly, belly in tight pants, coffee, sugar and milk in belly. I'm doomed. ;)

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Posted

*Aflatoxin B1, produced by a fungus that likes to grow on nuts, is one of the most potent carcinogens we know. Granted, the FDA has placed very strict rules on how many aflatoxin molecules can be found in peanut butter, but I doubt that every batch coming out of every peanut butter manufacturer actually gets screened.

Thank you for clarifying which nuts you are speaking of. ;)

And speaking of cancer and nether regions. Did you know the first cause and effect connection of cancer was that of scrotal cancer in London chimney sweeps caused by creosote.

a.m.

That pun was totally unindended. :) I think the fungus will grow on grains as well...

If I remember correctly, it wasn't just an English thing. Chimney boys were getting cancer everywhere there were chimneys. And either some English dude or some French dude told the chimney sweeps in his country to wash after work. The incidence of this cancer declined rapidly in that country as a result of that suggestion.

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Posted

Some of the discussions of the risks here are a bit unscientifc. There seems to be little mention of the high frequencies operating in the the processor and also embedded radio's (eg wifi). Microwave ovens operate at frequency of 2.45 ghz - which is the same frequency as the latest intel processors for notebooks AND the same frequency of 802.11g wifi.

microwave ovens are generally working at 10 times the power of a notebook processor HOWEVER the microwave oven is intentionally designed to shield the user from its radiation. I wonder if notebooks are designed to shield the radiation as well? If you have a plastic / carbon fiber cased notebook then perhaps not.

For those who are convinced that non ionising radiation is safe then i would challenge you to consider a few years down the line when moores law leaves us with 10Ghz processors, would you be equally as happy to have that kind of radiation right next to your genitals?!!

For safety i now work with my notebook at a table and often have the processor set to lower than its max performance. i just boost up the power when its required - for example when the antivirus is scanning incoming mails in the morning. I have a magnesium cased machine (Toshiba R500), which being metal may help to shield some of the processor radiation (but not the wifi).

I am unlikely to seek out higher processor performance in my next machine because i regard the risk to be too high. The R500 runs on 1.2ghz dual core which is about as high as i want to go wiht a notebook that will be in close proximity to me. For additional processing requirements i would probably look to remote accessing into a desktop somewhere or for gaming purposes to use one of the up and coming external laptop graphics units.

Notebooks are an awesome tool and i would be crushed to give mine up, however health is a wonderful thing and as you get older and see people tragically taken from you because of cancer you realise that the risk have to be taken seriously.

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Posted

For those who are convinced that non ionising radiation is safe then i would challenge you to consider a few years down the line when moores law leaves us with 10Ghz processors, would you be equally as happy to have that kind of radiation right next to your genitals?!!

Yes. I would be exactly as happy as I am now, and probably more happy. Ignoring the fact that processor speed has not been increasing anymore and that they've been adding more processors/cores instead, and also ignoring that your entire argument is pretty much nonsensical, one of the focuses these days is on producing components that use less power and generate less waste heat. As heat output is what actually causes problems (sit a computer that's using enough energy to be hot to the touch on your crotch all day, and at the very least it'll probably get sweaty and maybe irritated, and studies/common sense suggest that that much excess crotch heat is what would actually be responsible for reduced fertility, if anything, although it's just as possible/likely that exposure to various low-level environmental toxins is what's doing it, too), I'm thrilled by the potential of having a computer that's faster (or even just the same as now) but lower-powered sitting on my wang. It'll also do great things for battery life, too. Hooray for the future!

Yeah, risks should be taken seriously. People making up nonsense as they go along isn't serious, though; it's just nonsense. Well, unless you want to call it "serious"-ly misinformed, or something along those lines. We have this great thing called Science, but unfortunately a lot of people don't bother to understand it or the things we've come to learn through the scientific process before trying to apply those conclusions to other things in their own way. "I don't really know how it works or what I'm talking about, but it sounds scary!" is not a valid line of reasoning when doing anything "serious" last time I checked. The issue at hand is at the intersection of physics and biology, and you clearly have at best a misunderstanding of one of them, if not both, to be jumping to such conclusions.

Keep running your processor at a lower speed, though. I do the same thing, although automated, not manually (it speeds itself up and slows down as needed). It saves a lot of power, which is good for your battery and electrical bill, and it runs a lot cooler, which is good for it being comfortable to use (and good for your air conditioner when it's hot out). Excess heat also reduces the expected lifetime of various electronic components, so that's another benefit of doing that.

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Posted

OK, so maybe the electricity from laptops isn't a problem, but there's probably a component in them that is.

For a few months, I've been waking up extremely groggy, in only one of the houses where I sleep (I sleep in three different houses). It felt like my stomach was being crushed as well as queasiness, and doesn't make you want to get out of bed.

Well, I've finally found the culprit. I've even tested it out several times to make sure. If I sleep with my laptop under the bed (unplugged from the mains electricity), I don't sleep as well, and when I wake up I feel like shit. When I don't sleep with the laptop under the bed, everything is fine.

Obviously the other two places I sleep, I don't have the laptop with me, and I always sleep fine and feel great when I wake up.

If anyone has an explanation for this, that'd be great. Otherwise I won't be in the least surprised if one day soon I'm diagnosed with some form of cancer, in the stomach region perhaps...

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Posted

I heard something similar relating to cell phones on the news a while back. Maybe it's the same type of thing. Here's an article about it, but you can Google for others if you want more: Can't Sleep? Cell Phone Radiation Could Ruin Your Bedtime

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Posted

OK. Nalgas just figured out that if you google "laptop cancer" this thread is one of the first things to pop up.

I have this to say to you laptop cancer googlers: You're fucking idiots.

kthxbai

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