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starship_subaru

manic, and...sleepy?

32 posts in this topic

Just wondering if it is possible to feel the need to sleep a whole lot while manic.

 

I am having all of my usual manic symptoms, but sleeping like 8 to 12 hours every day.

 

It seems...odd. But then, I don't remember lack of sleep being a big part of my past manic episodes either. But isn't it supposed to be sort of...fundamental...to bipolar disorder?

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Is it possible your manic symptoms are better accounted for by something else? For example, have you had your thyroid checked recently or ever? 

 

However, it's probably possible to sleep a lot while manic. Weird, but probably possible. Lack of sleep is only one of the symptoms and technically you only need 3-4 symptoms off the criteria list to be considered hypo/manic. 

 

I can usually sleep up to 6 hours a night while hypomanic, and as little as 4. While 6 hours seems like a lot, it is contrasted with how I usually sleep, at the very least, 10 hours a night. 

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I was getting a full night's sleep during my recent hypomanic episode. It does seem like one of the most paramount symptoms while manic but I guess it depends. Like Para said, you probably need to only fit a few of the criteria to be considered manic and not necessarily the lack of sleep.

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I have often heard that decreased need for sleep is almost a universal symptom in mania, but I'm not sure if this is really true for everyone. The absolute number in my opinion don't tell much, but rather the change from normal sleep patterns, whatever those might be for you. For me personally, sleep is one of the biggest warning signs of mania, in hypomania means the need for sleep goes down by 1 hour or so, in mania it goes down to 3h a night. I sometimes need to catch up on sleep during long episodes, and then I might sleep longer, but then we are talking after a week of 'good' mania and 2h sleep/night.

 

From your signature it seems you are Type 2? Do you get manic or 'just' hypo? What are the symptoms? Could they be something else? I get agitated depressed states that have some hypomanic features like restlessness but no decreased need for sleep, could it be something like that?

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oops, sorry, I meant hypo!!

 

thanks for all the helpful ideas & suggestions. I think the last time I had my thyroid checked was almost 2 years ago and it was normal then, but my new pdoc is having me get all those tests again so I will know soon if it has changed.

 

the symptoms are lots of very intense and complicated religious/spiritual thoughts/ideas that just won't stop.... and sort of...a really enhanced appreciation for the beauty and suffering in the world, enhanced appreciation of music, art, religion, etc... it feels like everything is affecting my emotions 1,000-fold. lots of things touch me so deeply I start crying, sometimes happy tears sometimes not. also feeling very connected to God, or whatever is out there, however you want to define it...and to all living things in the world...

 

it kind of feels like a spiritual awakening, but I am also aware of the fact that it is a longer-lasting and more intense version of my past hypomanias. it's been building since august. the sleeping-10-hrs-a-day part started last month, I think. but I am definitely not depressed, just...tired. also I think sometimes anxiety makes me want to stay in bed for hours longer than I actually need to sleep.

 

I have always thought bipolar seemed like an odd diagnosis for me because I actually am missing a lot of the symptoms (don't get extroverted, don't get impulsive, don't talk fast, don't sleep less, etc.)... But it absolutely does feel like I have a sort of "sensitivity switch" where it is either turned all the way up or all the way down, so I guess that could be where my bipolar "poles" come from...

 

as for changes in sleep, the change that often seems to happen when I get Hypo is I begin to sleep a lot more during the day and a lot less during the night. ive never actually experienced a decreased need for sleep, just this change in when I sleep. and now, I have an increased need for sleep...WTF!!

 

sorry about the essay. I figure it's good to get this stuff written down somewhere so I can print it out later and bring it to the doc...

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Not sleeping at all or only a few hours a night is a big red flag for me as a symptom of mania. I just don't get tired.

I sleep the most when I'm depressed. anywhere from 12-22+ hours. I slept for 21 hours just today/yesterday whatever. And I'm about to go back to bed. I'm very tired.

I hope your symptoms improve soon. Take care.

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I pretty much don't sleep when I am hypo/manic.  When I start sleeping a whole lot more is when I am becoming depressed.

 

Idk what meds you are on, but maybe you should bring this up with your pdoc so s/he might tweak them to help you feel better.

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My body deteriorates really fast without sleep, so I'm always aware of when I need to sleep. I feel like shit. But I still usually can't sleep more than 6 hours (which is a huge deal for me, as I usually need 9-10), and sometimes as low as 3, while (hypo)manic. I have had a few huge sleep deficits in episodes be followed by solid 10 hour crashes, but at that point it usually isn't enough to correct anything. The episode just keeps deteriorating and moving along... I think there have also been a number of hypomanic episodes (somewhat milder ones) where I've slept fairly normally, so I guess it happens. 

 

In short, yeah, I feel the need to sleep while manic usually. I feel tired. But I also feel wired and unable to sleep properly. I don't think lack of sleep is an absolutely necessary component to bipolar disorder. I think it's just very, very common, as both a symptom and a trigger. 

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I've had a few hypomanic episodes, and the *need* for less sleep isn't one of my symptoms. I actually feel tired but the racing thoughts keep me awake.

My SO also has BP and he needs about 10hrs of sleep everyday, no matter what. But he also doesn't sleep more or less when depressed.

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I'm pretty sure I almost always feel more profoundly awake and need less sleep when hypo or manic. It's one of the most telling signs for me.

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I always tend to sleep 2-3 hours a night for 3 nights, and then crash on the 4th day, and sleep for like 13 hours. My pdoc told me that was a "normal" pattern for mania, but I don't get severe manias. When I am mixed I sleep more than when I am manic.

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I get a few hours while hypo a night, if that. Though it HAS happened that I've gotten as many as six hours before in separate episodes almost every night. The most euphoric ones I had I slept about 6 a night.

 

The other ones that sucked ass I was too excited to sleep and there was SO MUCH SHIT TO DO IT WAS AMAZING. psh.

 

I don't think you HAVE to get a small amount of sleep to be hypo, but it usually seems to come with the territory. 

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I do the same as crtclms.. Sleep a few hours for a few days, and then crash.

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I can usually sleep for a few hours a night, do that for a few days then get depressed, then go manic again and sleep a few hours a night.

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I always tend to sleep 2-3 hours a night for 3 nights, and then crash on the 4th day, and sleep for like 13 hours. My pdoc told me that was a "normal" pattern for mania, but I don't get severe manias. When I am mixed I sleep more than when I am manic.

 

Same here!  (When the illness hasn't reached yet to rapid cycling, I was mostly weeks manic. And when the illness wasn't marked yet I was hypomanic for a year. Then pattern of 3 weeks of mania did kick in... But I liked the hypomania!!  :D  :lol:  Now I'm always more manic...

 

But when I was on an AP (Abilify), I did get my sleep +even more. From the moment the AP was dropped the sleep was decreasing from 12 hours to 8 hours an eventually no sleep... This happened in the same week...  :D

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I normally sleep 8-10 hrs.  When I'm manic, I normally sleep badly for 4-6 hrs and don't really feel tired after that much sleep.  At some point I might drop to 3hrs but it's hard to judge since I sleep in this weird manic phase that borks everything.  I've never had to sleep more during mania tho.  

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I have had sleep problems since I was a small child. Normally it's intermittent, but last three years has been constant, with the exception of when I slipped and fell and hit my head on a big rock. I don't recommend that as a sleep aid, BTW. It really hurt for a long time. But I did get a good 8 hours straight, and it was heavenly. In '11 I was getting about five hours a night, sometimes split between two sessions. All of '12 and half of '13 was pretty much three hours, sometimes less. Rarely more. Was awful. Then since July I've been at four or five hours, mostly split between two sessions. But when not having a manic or mixed Espinosa or whatever, I am tired. But when I have the mania, I am pumped up and don't feel tired at all. And this mixed state or whatever you wanna call it is the shits. I'm tired and energized at the same time. It's a very weird feeling I don't know how to describe.

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i've had hypomanias where i'd slept anywhere between 5-7 hours a night. like some have said in previous comments, when it starts, i sleep 2-3 hours for the first 3-4 nights, then crash and sleep 10-11, etc but over the days it evens out and i sleep around 5-7. when i am awake, i am raging with energy and have various symptoms but i *do* sleep. it has been said many times that lack of sleep is a sort of "cornerstone" of the (hypo)mania diagnosis, but i do think it varies. i should also mention that my normal sleep is 8-10 hours, otherwise i don't feel rested. so i think it really is relative to whatever is normal for you.

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im starting to realize I need so many hours because much of it is not actually spent sleeping...but merely...trying to sleep.

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Even rest can be helpful. It's not the same as real sleep, of course, but it's better than a swift kick in the rear. I have a hard time staying in bed when I get the energy boost, unfortunately. If I try, the racing thoughts can get really bad. I need to get up and do something. But if I'm more normal, I can sleep 2-3 hours and then stay in bed for another 1-2 hours without any problems. Got more sleep last two days because I sedated myself with temazepam, soma, and Benadryl. Don't think my pdoc was too happy about that, but whatever. The waking hours were just miserable otherwise. Talked to him again today and he upped my lithium again. Will increase again Sunday, and maybe start seroquel on Monday for quicker relief. I've heard that seroquel can make you sleepy. I hope that's the case with me. One person I talked to said it merely made him "retarded" (his words, not mine).

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im starting to realize I need so many hours because much of it is not actually spent sleeping...but merely...trying to sleep.

 

yes.

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Do you struggle with mixed states? What are your symptoms?

 

Mixed states can be quite different from the more well known mania symptoms. I do not need to lose sleep to become psychotic. You can move a table in my art studio without telling me first and that will send me fully psychotic in the span of seconds. Mixed states are touchy to the smallest changes and stresses in daily life. Mixed states are also not euphoric or enjoyable in any way. The last thing I want to do when I am psychotic and going through a mixed state is to socialise and interact with other people. I also avoid talking whenever possible. I am also not creative, or motivated.

 

Mixed states are supposedly not a hugely common symptom in bipolar, but they are definitely just as serious and dangerous as the more traditional mania symptoms. Personally, I tend to think that they are far more common than they are supposed to be. I feel like I hear online stories about mixed states in Bipolar 1 people as more of a given than a minority. Just my opinion though, I don't have the numbers to prove anything.

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thanks saintalto...

 

hmm that's really interesting. I don't really know anything about mixed states, never talked about it with pdoc, but from your description, they sound....eerily familiar. being touchy to changes and stresses...that's me. it seems almost like it's a transition thing, like it happens between the more euphoric states and empty depressive states. ok better stop analyzing my moods before I make myself even crazier than I actually am!

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Personally, I tend to think that they are far more common than they are supposed to be. I feel like I hear online stories about mixed states in Bipolar 1 people as more of a given than a minority. Just my opinion though, I don't have the numbers to prove anything.

 

I agree with you, that mixed states are common with people who are bipolar.  I know I have been in them before, and they suck.

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