dtac

State wants to move Xanax from S4 to S2

39 posts in this topic

The thing is,[email protected], you're not a Moderator here. So your experience with 4-Chan or Reddit or wherever else you were tooling around has no meaning to this site or its standards. Butting heads with the site Moderators here is a sign of sheer unadulterated stupidity, but we make allowances for lunacy here at Crazyboards - on a limited basis.

 And you've just spent your allowance.

 

Cerberus
Moderator

 

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20 hours ago, Wooster said:

a) we are all batshit insane, @JustNuts

b) because we talk about meds this site has been the subject of higher than average scrutiny than in the past

c) we are all volunteers, and 

d) as such have no desire to police the PMs of a member who said they would do something that threatens the site for all users

e) if you don't like it here, feel free to leave

18 hours ago, Cerberus said:

The thing is,[email protected], you're not a Moderator here. So your experience with 4-Chan or Reddit or wherever else you were tooling around has no meaning to this site or its standards. Butting heads with the site Moderators here is a sign of sheer unadulterated stupidity, but we make allowances for lunacy here at Crazyboards - on a limited basis.

 And you've just spent your allowance.

 

Cerberus
Moderator

As I've explained already, your site is nothing special when it comes to the DMCA, the forum I was involved with had literally orders of magnitude higher risk at stake with far more actionable circumstances and yet they didn't resort to immature and irrational overreactions. The forum was also almost exclusively volunteer-ran, with approximately 110-130 active volunteer moderators and admins combined at any point in time and only a single paid staff member in charge of broad-scale community management. It also happened to be owned/controlled by a major company that would be extremely sensitive to DMCA issues for a number of reasons and yet didn't give a shit because they knew that the community was already clearly complying with their obligations under the DMCA via appropriate enforcement actions.

My point once again is that you have completely mishandled the situation, you have the most ridiculous views about what's actually appropriate or what's actually happened, and whenever it's brought up you revert right back to the same poorly-thought-out (and refuted) arguments combined with outright ad hominem attacks and thinly-veiled threats while flat-out ignoring, dismissing, or otherwise brushing aside everything any other forum member says.

"Batshit insane" or not, there's no excuse for acting like this. It's not the right way to run a community. It's not professional.

Let me remind you that I was not the one to bring this topic back up in here, I merely briefly summarized the reasons why nobody can send me private messages when a member asked why the private message button wouldn't show up on my profile. You guys are the ones who decided that this conversation deserved to be resurrected again beyond that point. So don't even try to blame me for that.

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@JustNuts Why do you continue to beat a dead horse? The word of the moderators is final, and this is particularly true in questions regarding board policy. As far as being unprofessional, where have we ever said we are professionals? This is a peer site ran by crazy people for crazy people. The moderators are all volunteer. Your continual actions of posting insults and taunting the moderators shows that you don't appreciate just how much on thin ice you are.

Also, taking away your ability to PM was not an overaction. It was a measured step to prevent us from having to police your PMs for criminal activity.

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Back to the original topic of benzos...

We just ran into someone needing a prior auth for Klonopin for the first time today. 

hooray.gif

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8 hours ago, JustNuts said:

Let me remind you that I was not the one to bring this topic back up in here, I merely briefly summarized the reasons why nobody can send me private messages when a member asked why the private message button wouldn't show up on my profile. You guys are the ones who decided that this conversation deserved to be resurrected again beyond that point. So don't even try to blame me for that.

And by doing that, you brought the topic back up. And now you should drop it. Forever. 

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Here in Australia Xanax has been a schedule 8 drug (same as CII, basically) for a long time. Few people seem to use it and it has a very bad rep. Valium and Restoril are very widely used, however.

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2 hours ago, mcjimjam said:

Here in Australia Xanax has been a schedule 8 drug (same as CII, basically) for a long time. Few people seem to use it and it has a very bad rep. Valium and Restoril are very widely used, however.

Interesting........What about Klonopin and Ativan?.....How widely are they used in Australia?

Just curious......:)

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On 4/20/2017 at 2:12 PM, HAL9000 said:

 

I understand some genius got like 100 different doctors to prescribe him opiates and this was all with the written scripts no auto refills etc.   HAVE A POINT and test the system to see if it has any effect before making everything a giant pain in the ass.

 

I say we have a government database of people and their doctors and their prescribed medications, that pharmacists, doctors, and the government can look at to make sure people are behaving themselves with their meds. Then there'd be no need for this nonsense.

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Posted (edited)

17 hours ago, Alien Navel Cord said:

I say we have a government database of people and their doctors and their prescribed medications, that pharmacists, doctors, and the government can look at to make sure people are behaving themselves with their meds. Then there'd be no need for this nonsense.

If a patient got opiates from 100 different docs, that sounds like what's called "doctor shopping", and it is a crime in all 50 states if I remember correctly..........Some people have done jail time for doc shopping, depending on the state laws.

The term "doctor shopping" means that a drug-seeking patient goes to multiple docs, who don't know about the other docs the patient has seen, and said patient gets the same or similiar "Scheduled" med prescribed multiple times...........Then usually, they try and fill each script at a different pharmacy.

However, all 50 states now have in place a Prescription Monitoring Program, or PMP, to track all patients who fill Scheduled meds, such as stimulants, benzos, or opiates, etc........The PMPs don't track non-scheduled meds such as anti-depressants or anti-psychotics.

This means that any doc or pharmacist that's treating you, or filling meds for you, can pull up your PMP record, and see exactly when and where you filled your last "Scheduled" med, and also they can see who prescribed the meds to you.

If a doc or pharmacist sees that you've been filling the same Scheduled med multiple times from different docs, they can get the DEA and/or law enforcement involved, again depending on the state.........Some states have stricter laws than others.

The PMPs have cut down on "doctor shopping" quite a bit, but it's still out there to a certain degree.

Edited by CrazyRedhead
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29 minutes ago, CrazyRedhead said:

If a patient got opiates from 100 different docs, that sounds like what's called "doctor shopping", and it is a crime in all 50 states if I remember correctly..........Some people have done jail time for doc shopping, depending on the state laws.

The term "doctor shopping" means that a drug-seeking patient goes to multiple docs, who don't know about the other docs the patient has seen, and said patient gets the same or similiar "Scheduled" med prescribed multiple times...........Then usually, they try and fill each script at a different pharmacy.

However, all 50 states now have in place a Prescription Monitoring Program, or PMP, to track all patients who fill Scheduled meds, such as stimulants, benzos, or opiates, etc........The PMPs don't track non-scheduled meds such as anti-depressants or anti-psychotics.

This means that any doc or pharmacist that's treating you, or filling meds for you, can pull up your PMP record, and see exactly when and where you filled your last "Scheduled" med.

The PMPs have cut down on "doctor shopping" quite a bit, but it's still out there to a certain degree.

You also have agreements with EHR vendors and SureScripts to provide data sharing between pharmacies and providers. If you fill a med a pharmacy that participates in SureScripts' network, controlled or not, it's visible to any platform that interfaces with SureScripts. Not all pharmacies participate, especially smaller ones, but all of your big retail chains are part of it, and most modern EHRs will pull data from SureScripts. I can't directly speak to it, but I suspect Allscripts has similar functionality for their interface. It also tends to integrate directly into the EHR, whereas the PMP database is a separate website.

Between the the data sharing and PMP databases, providers have tools to cover the majority of abuse cases -- they just don't bother to check. 

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Posted (edited)

47 minutes ago, dtac said:

 Between the the data sharing and PMP databases, providers have tools to cover the majority of abuse cases -- they just don't bother to check. 

Currently, 34 states have circumstances in which the doctor, pharmacist, or both, are required by law to check the PMP database:         http://www.namsdl.org/library/14D3122C-96F5-F53E-E8F23E906B4DE09D/    (page 2)

Are they really checking  everything they should?......I would say in a lot of cases, probably not..

This is just my opinion, but I believe they scrutinize patients getting Schedule 2 meds a lot more than patients getting Schedule 3-5 meds..

Edited by CrazyRedhead
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10 minutes ago, CrazyRedhead said:

Currently, 34 states have circumstances in which the doctor, pharmacist or both, are required by law to check the PMP database:         http://www.namsdl.org/library/14D3122C-96F5-F53E-E8F23E906B4DE09D/    (page 2)

Are they really checking  everything they should?......I would say in a lot of cases, probably not..

This is just my opinion, but I believe they scrutinize patients getting Schedule 2 meds a lot more than patients getting Schedule 3-5 meds..

I know my pdoc checks. I couldn't remember all the sleep meds I've taken, so he pulled up the database and started looking at benzos and z-drugs I was prescribed. He also scrutinized my benzo history before prescribing Xanax. If he's that interested in my CIV history, then I suspect he watches his CII patients as well. I don't take it personally, I'm honest about everything (including my OD attempt), and he's never declined to write for a med based on my rx history. In fact, he's the one that suggested Xanax for my anxiety, and told me he wasn't worried about me abusing it, he's just cautious. 

The only time I got questioned by a pharmacist was when I filled a rx for Sonata a week after I had filled one for Lunesta (I was alternating sleep meds at the time.) He just wanted to make sure I wasn't taking them together. He wasn't concerned beyond the possible synergistic effect of the meds.

I've never been on CII meds for a period of time (only one-off short-term fills for Lortab/Norco due to dental work, sinus infection, etc.) so I can't speak to how much the scrutiny increases, but only Xanax seems to have raised any eyebrows from CIV.

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Posted (edited)

14 minutes ago, dtac said:

I know my pdoc checks. 

My p-doc checked my fill history when I was a new patient.

Since I've been with her now for 4 years, she probably checks it occasionally, since she does still prescribe Klonopin for me.....That's the only controlled med I take right now.

I've never personally had any problems with a pharmacist about filling the Klonopin.

Edited by CrazyRedhead

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My doc just trusts me...which is really great cuz then I don't have to feel subconscious about asking for help with something 

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