wifezilla Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Max had a total meltdown today. All because I told him to stop using up all the mayo. He poured half a family sized bottle along with a stick of butter in to whatever "lunch" he was creating. Normally we keep this stuff locked up just because of this type of thing and give him a normal portion when he asks for it...but the mini-fridge went on the fritz and I had to put it big fridge and he helped himself. So anyway...I told him (calmly) to stop using up the mayo because he uses too much and its not good for him. So he starts screaming at me. Fine...whatever...so I then tell him (calmly) that if he doesn't stop screaming and behave himself, no fireworks tonight. Well, that really sets him off. More screaming, more yelling, hits the sliding glass door with his hand (didn't break, but made a lot of noise)...throws himself to the floor...generally acting like a jerk. I take some of his lunch and put it away for tomorrow knowing if he eats it all he will be packing away about 6000 calories. Max nicely asks "Put away for tomorrow?" and I say yes, exactly. But as soon as put it away he starts again...more yelling..screaming. So I go in to the office and shut the door. He runs out after me yelling "I'm warning you mom". I tell him again he needs to behave himself and yelling at me is not acceptable. No fireworks tonight and he is working on no pizza Friday (which is our routine) if he doesn't start acting like a good boy. So I sit down at the computer and he hits me on the shoulder, then reaches around and hits me in the stomache. Both hits were actually really pathetic and I had to stop myself from laughing. So I tell him that hitting me is not acceptable, and he is being very bad. More screaming. Then he slams my office door and I hear the glass patio door again...but it didn't sound like his fist. I get up to look and see whats going on and he had grabbed the hatchet out of the tool shed and was hitting the glass door...a little harder each time. So I take the axe away. I start yelling and tell him to go to his room. He tells me "No" so I take him by the arm and start walking towards his room. He throws himself on the floor again and I say "Get up and go to your room!". And then he comes up swinging. Punched me in the chest several times, on the arm, in the shoulder. No wussie punches this time. Oh great. I defend myself and block his punches, but he is WAY stronger than me and he outweighs me by about 50 pounds and is 4" taller...and obviously much younger. Then he runs to his room (and then punches another hole in his door) and I call hubby. He races home and they are having a "talk" right now. He apologized, but hell, I don't know if he means it. Right now I am in my office while son & dad are together in the house. I am typing through tears. Now what? He is 16, but in many ways he is more like 4. He is only going to get bigger and stronger. And he is my baby. Crap crap crap. We knew a group home might be a possibility in his future (like after high school which is 21 for him), but I didn't want to contemplate him having to leave because he was dangerous. He only has these meltdowns once in a great while, but FUCK! What if he does this in public? To someone at school? To me again? FUCKFUCKFUCK Now what?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breeze Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Oh Wifezilla: I'm so sorry. I don't know what the answer is. But I know you are a very good person. And you and hubby will figure this out. Maybe this was an isolated thing. Fireworks are once a year, maybe this set him off. I don't know though. I just want you to know I'm here and I'm so sorry. I wish I knew the answer. I think in any situation, you have to let things cool down a bit. Wait awhile. Let the hurt go away. Then think about what to do. Wish I could be of more help. But I'm listening. Breeze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celestia Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Aw man WZ, do written contracts work for ya'll? they did Big E was younger, but he also doesn't have any major dx'es. I'm the problem teenager at age 45. Looks like the same deal with Little E. Written deals seem to work well for the three of us. That sucks big time. Stay safe. S9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 4, 2006 Author Share Posted July 4, 2006 Written deals wont work for Max. His reading level is about 2nd grade. His comprehension...well..who knows. I am calming down right now, and no, I wont make any snap decisions. But this brings up ALL KINDS of issues. What do you do with a violent autistic who doesn't totally comprehend the consenquences for his actions? What happens if the neighbors call the cops? I don't have a lot of faith this would be handled in a good manner. Last year some stupid cop one town over shot a developmentally disabled kid and killed him. ...And this cop was familiar with the family! Hubby is making son help him fix all the damage he did to the door. They are painting over the patch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breeze Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 I know this sounds kinda weird. But maybe you could take a self defense class. That way, you won't be afraid of him ( as I sense you are becoming now ) and you could rest assured when you're alone with him. Just a thought. Breeze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 4, 2006 Author Share Posted July 4, 2006 While it was a frightening experience, I could have cold-cocked him. I was being totally defensive. Had I gotten offensive, I would have ended up in jail. That wouldn't have helped either one of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirMarshall Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Wifezilla, A friend of mine had a similar problem with a child. She finally realized that trying to reason with the kid when he was in the middle of a tantrum was pointless. She would let the kid wear himself out, get over the emotion and then deal with the behavior at that point when he would be able to listen again. I guess we all get out of control sometimes. a.m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMF Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 I'm so sorry....does he work with a behavorial interventionist? If so, I'd bring them in on this. You shouldn't live in fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepia Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 I know you're trying to do the Good Parent thing and curtail harmful behaviors when you intervene, but I have to bring in some of my own feeling on this. When I flip out (which, for me, is nonviolent), you cannot accomplish anything with me. You cannot explain things. You cannot correct things. The only thing I will hear is that you are going to fix every single thing that's bothering me, instantly, which is the only thing I want, and even THAT might take a while to sink in. Any further communication -- and I do mean ANY -- will escalate my freakout. I am not really in control when I've reached the temper tantrum stage. Don't reason with me. Wait. I can't look at this scenario you've presented and say with any great certainty "here's where you should have backed off," but the idea of letting the temper tantrum happen without any further input might be useful in the future. As for going after you with the vague idea of physical coercion solving things... who else works with Max? Who are his teachers? Who does he trust? Deliberate hitting is a strategy which must be unlearned. That is a problem my aunt has had with her very un-autistic son. How you deal with the problem will probably be different, but blaming all violent behavior on autism strikes me as wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
praxis Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 I'm sorry your family is going through this. I can tell it is causing you a lot of pain. My knowledge is very limited in this area, but lmnop's advice seems right to me on a gut level FWIW. I think it's best if he can learn to calm himself or at least wear himself out. If he can't do that, is there some way you could restrain him during these tantrums? It's scary to think he might hurt himself or you or someone else. I have a big scary nephew. He's not autistic and I don't know his dx, but he has a lot of rage simmering beneath the surface. I don't know how we might have helped him, but I can't help wondering if some kind of intensive treatment when he was under 18 might have made a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenonice Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 There are physical interventions used in group homes that help a smaller person contain a larger viloent person. They are not offenceive and might help you. Are you working with a social worker? Maybe they could help you get that training? Raven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null0trooper Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 While it was a frightening experience, I could have cold-cocked him. I was being totally defensive. Had I gotten offensive, I would have ended up in jail. That wouldn't have helped either one of us. It also could have taught him that violence works. That is one of the risks in escalating a fight - both sides learn how to do it harder, faster, better, for next time. That is also a problem with escalating punishments ... it increases the pressure in a situation that he already may not be able to comprehend or deal with, and leaves little room for either of you to back down. I must disagree with Praxis, this is not the age to teach someone that physically restraining the other person is the best way to win a fight. Not only "no hitting" but "no grabbing". For the sake of the skittish I won't get graphic... HOWEVER, I DON'T think it's a matter of having a "violent autistic" but rather the fact that he is a healthy male child going through puberty. Hormones raging, frustration levels pegged to the max, even things like balance and muscle control are out-of-kilter. That must be a constant source of irritation and frustration for your son. This is definitely moving into "call the experts" time, because ALL of you need to have a way to safely disengage without interference from the rest. How about a heavily padded room with a shielded light source and a punching bag? Maybe two, for when the space alien FBI mind-tapping rays come probing after your hubby? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 "let the kid wear himself out, get over the emotion and then deal with the behavior at that point when he would be able to listen again." Sounds like a good plan. I obviously need a tactics change. Thanks lmnop for describing what happens to you. Your description describes Max's reactions to a T. Between what you and Airmarshall said, I think I have a new way to approach this. Thank you thank you thank you. "blaming all violent behavior on autism strikes me as wrong" Don't misunderstand. I am not blaming the autism, but the autism does create a HUGE communication barrier that makes it very difficult for me to manage the situation like you would with your average teen. Obviously whatever worked with Max's big brother when he was being a jerk is NOT working with Max. The autism compounds the problem, but doesn't necessarily cause it. "he is a healthy male child going through puberty. Hormones raging, frustration levels pegged to the max" I'm sure that is a part of it. "How about a heavily padded room with a shielded light source and a punching bag? Maybe two, for when the space alien FBI mind-tapping rays come probing after your hubby?" Or how about one, decorated in pink, for me to hide in when things get too overwhelming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 I am pretty sore. I hope I don't have bruises tomorrow. the left side of my face, neck and chest are kind of puffly. Bleh. Side note: Max was an angel for the rest of the day. Dad decided we should see the fireworks since it is a once a year thing, but we did not go to the park with the several thousand other people. We found a middle school that had just been built on this bluff we thought might overlook the park. We were right. We had a great view of the fireworks in the park as well as displays from 2 other communities. We ended up having an entire football field all to ourselves so Max got to spazz out as much as he wanted. Afterwards, we had no traffic to fight to get home. 10 minutes after we got through the door, the sky opened up and it started raining like crazy. Perfect timing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null0trooper Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 "How about a heavily padded room with a shielded light source and a punching bag? Maybe two, for when the space alien FBI mind-tapping rays come probing after your hubby?" Or how about one, decorated in pink, for me to hide in when things get too overwhelming It came to mind that that is one of the things that is associated with mental illness - "the rubber room" - although the world is so crazy that maybe we could ALL use one. Add a few strategically-placed D-rings, and it could be quite, um, multipurpose... but I digress Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 :::ponders that someone may have been hanging around RedDog too long::: (ponders that I should not let people know that I am aware of recreational uses for a D-ring) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Libby Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I have no clue about the D rings. Bondage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I think of D-rings and how handy they are for binders. Much better than the plain ol' round circle ones. Especially the locking D-rings so that the papers don't fall out. Oh, you weren't typing about THOSE types of D-rings! oopsies.... hee hee hee... *plays innocent* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celestia Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I think of D-rings and how handy they are for binders. Much better than the plain ol' round circle ones. Especially the locking D-rings so that the papers don't fall out. Oh, you weren't typing about THOSE types of D-rings! oopsies.... hee hee hee... *plays innocent*Reddog's tutotials are memorably written...and, of course, as a mod and admin you have to read ALL our "how to stuff" make sure it's not dangerous to the "gentle reader", there are 1 or 2 amongst us doncha think? /tjack WZ it sounds like the day ended well and with some family *closeness* for lack of a better word. I have always liked the idea of a padded room, more so for acoustics, but somewhere soft, safe, mellow in the house. S9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latin Girl Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Wifezilla, As a Mom this breaks my heart. You sound like you did the right thing at the time. I want to just hug you and say "You are a good Mom"!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddog Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 *ahem* d rings are what you use to tighten the straps on your backpack and fanny pack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 Thanks for everyone's kind words and advise...and the entertaining thread jack. (I needed a good laugh....ah..Red..your halo is slipping ) All of the posts were very helpful, each in a different way (you guys rock!) Today has been quite normal....or what passes for normal around here. We had errands to run and Max always enjoys a good car ride. We were blasting classic rock with the windows rolled down. He grinned the whole time. I am beginning to wonder if my artificial sweetner experiment may have played a part in this. ( http://www.crazyboards.org/forums/index.ph...c=12158&hl= ) Splenda may not be a good match for Max either. In retrospect, there are some clues silly NT mom missed that Max was having issues.... complaints of a headache (migraine?), extra humming and chanting (he does this all the time, but it seems to be a lot more lately), putting his fingers in his ears more, etc... Boy with NO FILTERS raised by mom with XTRA STRENGTH filters....sometimes not a good combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest espressogrrl Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 Jesus, lady. you are a hell of a mom. how you kept yourself from swinging, I don't know. Matty (my cousin who lives with us and is more like a nephew, his dad and I are 7 years apart) has these episodes too....only he is severely autistic - like the no-talking kind. He's 15 and they are STRONG. It's dangerous if you arent properly trained like my mother isnt properly trained. You have the patience of a saint. Now Matty is way less functioning than your angel Max, so I doubt i could give you any advice. I just know that my sis and my uncle let him go on a rampage until he starts to hurt himself, then they have to restrain him. they only interfere when there is danger involved, but until there is...they ignore him until he stops. then they shower him with love and attention and positive reinforcements that teach him good behavior gives him the love he needs. the episodes have gotten fewer. thats all i know. i wish i could be of more help. but you should know that you are so admired - what an amazing mom!!! ps. he loves you. he didnt mean it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wifezilla Posted July 6, 2006 Author Share Posted July 6, 2006 Hey..every little bit of information helps. Max's functioning level is also something that changes. Some days he is right there with me on stuff. Other days it takes a lot of hand waving and "HEY MAX" to get him to even notice you are there. And strong...hell yeah. I don't think he has any idea how strong he really is. (Good thing ) After things had calmed down I went in the office and hubby followed me out. I had a good cry and then Max walked it. I think seeing me cry really got to him. I heard a lot of "I'm sorry. Don't cry mommy" And like I said before, he has been fine ever since. (and you are too nice) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latin Girl Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 I had a good cry and then Max walked it. I think seeing me cry really got to him. I heard a lot of "I'm sorry. Don't cry mommy" Awwwwwwwwwww...........Good Mommy! This just touched me so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WholeNewHomeBody Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 *ahem* d rings are what you use to tighten the straps on your backpack and fanny pack. Yeah, when you have a slave attached to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Libby Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 *ahem* d rings are what you use to tighten the straps on your backpack and fanny pack. Yeah, when you have a slave attached to them. oh, like for a d*ldo harness? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WholeNewHomeBody Posted August 15, 2006 Share Posted August 15, 2006 *ahem* d rings are what you use to tighten the straps on your backpack and fanny pack. Yeah, when you have a slave attached to them. oh, like for a d*ldo harness? Well, that would be one way of attaching a slave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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