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I Need help, But the Hospital is Sick of Me


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My mind goes in circles. My recurrent impulse is to kill myself -- that's all I can think about. I have no will to eat, in fact I have no appetite at all anymore. I look down the road of my life and see nothing but decades of this same shit to come - mood swings, unemployment, poverty, lonliness etc.. etc..

Sure there is always the hospital, but I have already used up my time there; they don't want me back. I have been 3 times in 4 months and was rejected the last time I went. I don't want to go back to the ER because I am made to feel like a scum bag when I go with suicidal thoughts. The nurses chuckle and laugh and make fun of my condition. Besides, I am sure the docs think my condition is refractory. All they will do is send me to a state hospital where I will lose my freedom and some civil rights permanately on top of everything else. I feel my medication combo will never be worked out correctly and I feel my brain physiology is immune to anti-depressant effects. Actually, I am not sure what I feel anymore - my mind is like a hurricane inside with thoughts being swirled around in a chaotic fashion.

I think I will starve myself into submission. I want to go lie down and not wake up. I have no purpose but to simply exist and take up space. My family is sick of it, I am sick of it, God is sick of it. Maybe the afterlife will be more kind to me.

I never cry but I can feel the tears hitting now. This isn't something I should do as a man.

Regards.

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IT IS OKAY FOR MEN TO CRY!

Crying is a form of HUMAN expression, and you deserve that right of release.

Please, please, please hang on. I know all seems hopeless and futile at this moment, but remember nothing is permanent. All our situations are temporary.

Most suicidal crisis situations last 72 hours at most. I know that can seem like an eternity when in the middle of it....but to me that represents HOPE for a waning of this intense distress.

You are valuable. You are here for a reason. We are listening, please keep talking to us.

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My mind goes in circles. My recurrent impulse is to kill myself -- that's all I can think about. I have no will to eat, in fact I have no appetite at all anymore. I look down the road of my life and see nothing but decades of this same shit to come - mood swings, unemployment, poverty, lonliness etc.. etc..

Sure there is always the hospital, but I have already used up my time there; they don't want me back. I have been 3 times in 4 months and was rejected the last time I went. I don't want to go back to the ER because I am made to feel like a scum bag when I go with suicidal thoughts. The nurses chuckle and laugh and make fun of my condition. Besides, I am sure the docs think my condition is refractory. All they will do is send me to a state hospital where I will lose my freedom and some civil rights permanately on top of everything else. I feel my medication combo will never be worked out correctly and I feel my brain physiology is immune to anti-depressant effects. Actually, I am not sure what I feel anymore - my mind is like a hurricane inside with thoughts being swirled around in a chaotic fashion.

I think I will starve myself into submission. I want to go lie down and not wake up. I have no purpose but to simply exist and take up space. My family is sick of it, I am sick of it, God is sick of it. Maybe the afterlife will be more kind to me.

I never cry but I can feel the tears hitting now. This isn't something I should do as a man.

Regards.

There is always the possiblility of change if you don't kill yourself. I say this to myself every day, many times. I dont know where you are, have you called a crisis line? sometimes it helps to just talk to a person. Next question. Do you have another hospital in a near by town? can you get someone to drive you there. Are you in therapy? you really need to be if you are not. The act of needing to cry is not, in spite of popular opinion, a gender based need. Crying is natural and you need to let out the pain. Likely there is another hospital that you can get to . You are in a crisis state and need help. Keep posting, we are all here and most of us have been through something like what you are going through. PM me if you like. I will try to help in any manner possible.

Small hugs for a hurt soul

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Hi

It's a lousy, mean world out there, I know. I hate it that people have been mean to you--hate it! I want to find them and punch their lights out! No one should laugh at someone in pain...ever. I'm not laughing at you and I care. Other people here are not laughing or brushing you off and care about you and what you're going through. Do--not--give--up. Okay?

I'm going to tell you the truth...maybe you know it already, but I'm going to say it anyway. The despairing voice in your head that says, Forget it, let's just be off with it...that's the illness talking. Your meds are not right and your illness is talking loud right now. I want to punch your illness's lights out, too, right now!

Getting meds right can really suck. It's hard for some people. You talked about your depression being refractory. My dad is in that position, too, and it is painful...painful for him and painful for me and for the rest of the family to watch. We want it over, we want him to be okay, we want him to be able to get up in the morning and enjoy life and we want *some* med to just work, dammit. But you gotta keep trying. Maybe titrating up on the Seroquel is going to help. Maybe the SSRI you're on is a loser. Who knows.

Demand options. Don't let the voices of despair in your illness or the fear that others have given up on you let you stop demanding new tries at stuff. Maybe non-med options. Relaxation techniques, yoga, I have no idea, but do not stop trying...anything. Because you were given this life for a purpose. You are here touching lives whether you know it or not. I believe that.

No giving up.

Keep posting.

We're here.

~Cat

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A.S.,

You feel bad because the illness is not being controlled. You haven't done anything wrong. You aren't to blame for anything.

Try to not be scared. Having suicidal thoughts is an indication that your meds mean adjusting, but not that you are going to die.

Regardless of how many times you have been to the ER, if you do not feel safe, if you think you are might hurt yourself, then go to the ER!!! The must help you and they will help you.

You need to call your Pdoc first thing Tuesday morning and tell him that you are suicidal and how bad you feel. Your pdoc should arrange to see you immediately or give you a med change. If things don't improve call him again.

If things are too bleak, take 5 minutes to read this one page:

http://www.metanoia.org/suicide/

Don't give up! No matter what you think, there are many people who would be crushed if you were gone.

Give you pdoc a call in the morning, and let us know how you are doing.

best, a.m.

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let me tell you a story, and all regular members of CB have heard it before, so may want to skip it, or read on if you're moved by it-

my dad commited suicide in may of '04. i found him in the middle of the floor. it was an overdose of his meds. never in my life could i have imagined the pain i would feel, and continue to this day to feel. i never knew what pain was- even in my most suicidal of times, the pain wasn't THAT bad, not like THIS. THIS was a soul pain, when you know a part of your soul was just ripped away and the whole you, the you that you were, dies and you are some kind of new creature.

he was suicidal. he had the same kinds of thoughts and feelings that you have. he was on ineffective medications. something wasn't right. he was ony 46, wtih a lifetime in front of him, with 4 children (including me) leaning on him. he took his own life and the rest of us are paying for it for the rest of ours.

i'm paying for his suicide every day of my life, and will continue to pay. i pay, and have paid, with my heart, soul, and spirit. i would give anything in my life to have him back. i'd be homeless and in dire need and starving to have him back. anything.

when you kill yourself, you do more than end pain for yourself. you rip the souls of those loved ones apart. people do love you and care about you very much, whether you in your illness can see it or not. those people would be ripped to shreds and constantly blaming themselves, be angry with you, themselves, and god, and they'd die too in that sense.

whatever you do, think of other people. live for other people if you can't live for yourself. life is so precious. you only know it when someone you love more than anything is ripped from you so heartlessly and coldly.

thinking of you-

loon

edited to add- would you rather have stupid, idiotic nurses laughing at you, or people destroyed and totally lost at your grave? please go to the hospital when you're afraid you'll harm yourself. they can't turn you away.

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A.S.,

You feel bad because the illness is not being controlled. You haven't done anything wrong. You aren't to blame for anything.

Try to not be scared. Having suicidal thoughts is an indication that your meds mean adjusting, but not that you are going to die.

Regardless of how many times you have been to the ER, if you do not feel safe, if you think you are might hurt yourself, then go to the ER!!! The must help you and they will help you.

You need to call your Pdoc first thing Tuesday morning and tell him that you are suicidal and how bad you feel. Your pdoc should arrange to see you immediately or give you a med change. If things don't improve call him again.

If things are too bleak, take 5 minutes to read this one page:

http://www.metanoia.org/suicide/

Don't give up! No matter what you think, there are many people who would be crushed if you were gone.

Give you pdoc a call in the morning, and let us know how you are doing.

best, a.m.

I just woke up. I just want to sleep all I can to avoid having to be awake with my thoughts. I try to make it 18 hours a day if possible.

I just saw my pdoc last week and he put me on Seroquel. I wasn't feeling anywhere nearly as bad as this then. The Seroquel has slowed my thought patterns way down but simultaneously has made me very depressed. It could be the fact that I am on such a low dose (I hear that you need to be on at least 300mg for depression, at least according to the BOLDER II study). The Seroquel has definitely worked for my racing thoughts and uncontrollable anxiety, but it appears to have worked too well and swung me to the other pole. I dunno, it is possible that I was going to hit this depressive spell anyway. The last few months have been more manic and anxiety filled. Now everything seems so slow and my mind seems to trudge along.

I can't see my doc for two more weeks, that is the rule. My day treatment program only allows one to see the doc once a month and I have already been seeing him more often than that. I don't want to push it. I feel like I am taking up too much of his and other patient's time. The Zoloft does not seem nearly as effective as the Prozac that he took me off of a while back - at least not for my depression (though my anxiety seems better). A lot of people I talk to hate Zoloft, my mother included.

Maybe I need another SSRI, but those take at least 4 weeks to get any effect, which is why I feel the hospital would be futile; there is no way they will allow me to stay for 4 weeks. The wait on SSRI's is what sux. I am not sure how long I have been on Zoloft but I believe it has been more than four weeks.

Thanks for all the posts. I will try to go to sleep in a few hours and check back in tomorrow. Sleep is my refuge from life.

Regards

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Report those nurses. 1. to the nurse manager of the unit. 2. to the director of the hospital. 3. to the agency that holds their licensing. They are not professional and their treatment is harmful. There are lots of horrible irresponsible people working in hospitals because the pay to health care professionals is not that great. Great professionals won't work for very long on the floors. I say that there is at least one reportable instances per hospital stay per person. For those that don't have anything go wrong there are times when someone else has two or three bad experiences. When my sister was in the hospital recently I had to report two RNs. One did not do anything while sis was in cardiac distress (she ended up in ICU/her heart stopped). I had told the nurse what her respiratory rate was and she should have acted on it. The other nurse was not treating a bed sore. I spoke to SIX, yes six, people before the dumb nurse was forced to do something about the sore as each day it was getting worse.

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I could start discussing my opinions of the modern medical community on here, but at this time I'd rather not trigger myself into a mixed/rageful state and/or violate CB's terms of use policies.

Anyways. About the meds.

I know this is going to sound silly, but I'm looking at your SN and have this instant impression that you don't play nice with AAPs. The sedative AAPs (namely Seroquel and Zyprexa) can cause akathisia in some people... and they can cause it real bad. There is also sedated akathisia (combine the problems of thoughts racing, anxiety, and doom with heavy sedation and sleeping most of the day).

I've bitched about that enough, that's been seen here. The disastrous choice to go on Zyprexa arguably ruined my entire life, and I didn't even know I was being hit with akathisia, since I was so sedated the whole time. That's why I want you to reconsider the use of Seroquel.

Also, have you considered jumping off of the SSRI train and onto the (related) SSNRI bandwagon? SSRNIs hit your issues at both serotonin and norepinephrine, so their action is more far-reaching, which means these drugs may help you out more than regular SSRIs.

Of course, they might also knock you into an uncontrollable mania, so the decision is between you and your docs. For future reference, Cymbalta and Effexor are the two SSNRIs currently available on market.

Also check to see if the "atypical" antidepressants trazodone and Remeron might be right for you. These actually block serotonin receptors (blocking the 'bad' kinds; there are many types, both 'good' and 'bad') and can be very potent in combination with an SSRI/SSNRI. Drawbacks are that they are both knockout drops (as in they're used more as sleeping pills than they are antidepressants), and that this potency, as with SSNRI use, can rocket you into mania. (Trazodone and Cymbalta rocketed me into hypomania, FYI.)

Anyways, let us know how the next turn in your treatment works out, and I hope it's for the better. Tweaking these meds to actually get ourselves into something resembling a useful state of being takes a lot of time. Hopefully your pdoc will cooperate with you, so you won't have to see him as often.

And also, note that I'm not a medical professional (I'm just a professional patient), so anything I might be saying above may be completely ill advice.

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I could start discussing my opinions of the modern medical community on here, but at this time I'd rather not trigger myself into a mixed/rageful state and/or violate CB's terms of use policies.

Anyways. About the meds.

I know this is going to sound silly, but I'm looking at your SN and have this instant impression that you don't play nice with AAPs. The sedative AAPs (namely Seroquel and Zyprexa) can cause akathisia in some people... and they can cause it real bad. There is also sedated akathisia (combine the problems of thoughts racing, anxiety, and doom with heavy sedation and sleeping most of the day).

I've bitched about that enough, that's been seen here. The disastrous choice to go on Zyprexa arguably ruined my entire life, and I didn't even know I was being hit with akathisia, since I was so sedated the whole time. That's why I want you to reconsider the use of Seroquel.

Also, have you considered jumping off of the SSRI train and onto the (related) SSNRI bandwagon? SSRNIs hit your issues at both serotonin and norepinephrine, so their action is more far-reaching, which means these drugs may help you out more than regular SSRIs.

Of course, they might also knock you into an uncontrollable mania, so the decision is between you and your docs. For future reference, Cymbalta and Effexor are the two SSNRIs currently available on market.

Also check to see if the "atypical" antidepressants trazodone and Remeron might be right for you. These actually block serotonin receptors (blocking the 'bad' kinds; there are many types, both 'good' and 'bad') and can be very potent in combination with an SSRI/SSNRI. Drawbacks are that they are both knockout drops (as in they're used more as sleeping pills than they are antidepressants), and that this potency, as with SSNRI use, can rocket you into mania. (Trazodone and Cymbalta rocketed me into hypomania, FYI.)

Anyways, let us know how the next turn in your treatment works out, and I hope it's for the better. Tweaking these meds to actually get ourselves into something resembling a useful state of being takes a lot of time. Hopefully your pdoc will cooperate with you, so you won't have to see him as often.

And also, note that I'm not a medical professional (I'm just a professional patient), so anything I might be saying above may be completely ill advice.

Well I don't think akathisia is a problem for me at the moment. When I was on Geodon, for the past several months, it was a big problem at times.

Seroquel has actually slowed my thoughts considerably compared to Geodon. Geodon seemed to send me into a more agitated/manic state than I was already. I feel better mentally now that I have gotten off the Geodon (my head doesn't feel lit up), but I feel more depressed at the same time. If I can find the anti-depressant effects of a Geodon combined with the thought slowing and relaxation of a Seroquel, I think I will have found the perfect combination. As I said previously, maybe I need to up the dose of Seroquel as all the studies show that the anti-depressant effects begin at 300+mg.

I am doubting the need of AAP's all together. For the past several years I was fairly stable on just Prozac and Trileptal. I wonder what it would be like if I just dropped Seroquel all together.

Later.

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I'm not sure if Seroquel is going to help lift up your depression at 300mg if all it's doing at 75mg is knocking you out the whole day. From what I understand, the effect of Seroquel is just a straight line increase in sedation as the dose goes up... though honestly I have no idea, we need the input of a Seroquel user on here.

And since it seems that you really want something a bit sedating/relaxing, you might want to discuss trazodone or Remeron with your pdoc. Again, these also will amplify the effects of SSRIs/SSNRIs if you are taking one of those with one of these.

**Also, NOTE: Remeron (known generically as mirtazapine) should NOT be confused with Rozerem (ramelteon), which is coincidentally also a sedative, albeit one that was designed to be used as a sedative. Rozerem works on melatonin, and many people with depression don't like their melatonin being dorked with (me included).

EDIT: Also, trazodone and Remeron are both used to kick-start AD treatment, since SSRIs and SSNRIs both take 4-6 weeks to start working. Many people find that these RIs start working earlier if they get supplemented with the above two meds.

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I know sleeping all day isn't healthy and it's hard to see things start to get better from where you are right now, but sleeping all day was what kept me breathing as well. So if you are torn between the two and doing something isn't helping, and you have already called your pdoc (they sometimes can change meds over the phone -- call it in to the pharmacy in an emergency situation), but the most important thing is you staying here, because here is where the change can happen. It's a long road and a hard one, (I'm currently facing getting incompletes in classes if I don't start showing up more often) but I'm convinced that since we're all humans dealing with human conditions we can all get through this if we keep trying.

Also, you can try calling your local women's shelter (I know it sounds weird but they have a LOT of information and can usually refer you to someplace that can help you with whatever your need is or refer you to a place that will refer you, blah blah blah you get the point).

Tears are better than bottling things up. It's good to cry. I'm sending good vibes to you, maybe it can help you get more strength.

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I know sleeping all day isn't healthy and it's hard to see things start to get better from where you are right now, but sleeping all day was what kept me breathing as well. So if you are torn between the two and doing something isn't helping, and you have already called your pdoc (they sometimes can change meds over the phone -- call it in to the pharmacy in an emergency situation), but the most important thing is you staying here, because here is where the change can happen. It's a long road and a hard one, (I'm currently facing getting incompletes in classes if I don't start showing up more often) but I'm convinced that since we're all humans dealing with human conditions we can all get through this if we keep trying.

Also, you can try calling your local women's shelter (I know it sounds weird but they have a LOT of information and can usually refer you to someplace that can help you with whatever your need is or refer you to a place that will refer you, blah blah blah you get the point).

Tears are better than bottling things up. It's good to cry. I'm sending good vibes to you, maybe it can help you get more strength.

I haven't had contact with my pdoc. I can't just "call" him, it doesn't work that way here. You have to go to a pnurse first, then get an appointment scheduled - yes even in a crisis. I've been through this dance before, trying to walk in during a crisis and see a doc. They wouldn't let me, so I raised a lot of hell at the nurses and they just raised hell back, telling me that that is their policy - NO ONE gets to see a doc without an appointment, it doesn't matter the crisis. And, no, you can NEVER talk to a doc on the phone either. If there is a real crisis, then you must go to the ER, they say. I have pissed off a couple of nurses permanately because of this. Some of them still give me nasty looks when I see them.

I was going to go to my day therapy today at the MH clinic but I felt like shit (at my stomach) so I got undressed and just went back to bed. Hopefully I can make it tomorrow. At least I can tell the social workers how I feel. Usually telling the social workers how you feel doesn't result in getting to see a doc. You have to remember, there are hundreds, if not thousands, of patients per doc. That's what you get when you go to a state funded, free clinic. That's why I wish I could have medicaid so that I could go to a private pdoc and get better care. My MH clinic has like 4 docs, and they have to cover like 4 counties and probably (I guesstimate) at LEAST 250,000 people - 4 docs! I am pretty sure this is the only MH clinic within a 50-75 mile radius.

Really, I am not in any hurry to contact my pdoc anyway because I am not sure if there is anything he can do for me. Sure, he can give me a prescription change, but the new med will take 4-6 weeks to have any effect. I guess sometimes we must just fight through this shit on our own, using sheer will power. Pdocs aren't always the answer.

And, yes, I know how it is to flunk out of college due to not being able to attend class. My GPA is shot to hell to the point that I can't even get back into college. I even sent a letter to the review board telling them I was BP and they turned me down anyway. I think they just don't want the mentally ill attending their college, I suppose they feel it is a liability (they don't want crazies disrupting classes, you know). Those review committees don't give a flying **** about anything but their own asses. I am sick of the whole system; everything from universities to the mental health system.

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Report those nurses. 1. to the nurse manager of the unit. 2. to the director of the hospital. 3. to the agency that holds their licensing. They are not professional and their treatment is harmful. There are lots of horrible irresponsible people working in hospitals because the pay to health care professionals is not that great. Great professionals won't work for very long on the floors. I say that there is at least one reportable instances per hospital stay per person. For those that don't have anything go wrong there are times when someone else has two or three bad experiences. When my sister was in the hospital recently I had to report two RNs. One did not do anything while sis was in cardiac distress (she ended up in ICU/her heart stopped). I had told the nurse what her respiratory rate was and she should have acted on it. The other nurse was not treating a bed sore. I spoke to SIX, yes six, people before the dumb nurse was forced to do something about the sore as each day it was getting worse.

I don't know if you saw one of my other posts where I discussed how badly I was treated when I went to the ER several months back. I was suicidal and just feeling totally disorganized and confused.

The nurse triaged me and took me back to a room, he then walked out of my room and into the hallway. After he got outside, he said in a LOUD outburst:

"That guy in there says he is suicidal, let me go get him a gun and see if he is serious." Then he laughed like a hyenia.

I wish I would have gotten his name, but I was so screwed up at the time that I didn't even care. Now it really pisses me off. I still may pursue it if there is a way I can find out his name. The problem is I am the one who is crazy and no one would believe me. It is my word against his, and I am sure the other nurses who heard it would take up for him, not me. That's one of the problems we all face.

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"That guy in there says he is suicidal, let me go get him a gun and see if he is serious." Then he laughed like a hyenia.

I wish I would have gotten his name, but I was so screwed up at the time that I didn't even care. Now it really pisses me off. I still may pursue it if there is a way I can find out his name. The problem is I am the one who is crazy and no one would believe me. It is my word against his, and I am sure the other nurses who heard it would take up for him, not me. That's one of the problems we all face.

Given the mood you were in (and I assume it wasn't a good one, given that you were in a panic/manic state), I personally would have responded, without skipping a beat: "That jackass nurse here's making unprofessional jokes about me, the patient... let me go get his supervisor, and a malpractice lawyer while I'm at it down here, and see if he really meant it. ASSHOLE!"

Then I'd go back in and calmly lie back on the exam table.

Note that I don't recommend doing any of the above; that might get you put into restraints, especially since they're obviously (and erroneously, of course) thinking you're some sort of "social misfit" to begin with. ER nurses and docs are under tremendous stress to begin with and they somehow feel that making unprofessional comments constitutes a form of tension-reducing humor. It's sad to say, but you're not alone in having this sort of crap happening...

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  • 2 weeks later...

Yes I did see what else you wrote and that is horrible treatment. I'm sorry this happened to you. How are you doing now?

I'm making it. Going to my treatment a few times a week, taking my meds, coming home and being extremely bored. I am somewhat depressed by the fact that I feel I have no purpose - I just come home and vegetate, and usually I will just sleep out of boredom (which sucks). I don't think this is something that a med change can fix. I think the meds have done about all they can do at this point.

Very few things at this point bring me any happiness. I don't want to call it depression because I feel a lot more stable now than I did a couple of months ago when I was on the Geodon and having EXTREME anxiety attacks every other day. I am on the max dose of Zoloft, so I don't know what else the meds can do for my depression/boredom. Perhaps it is time that I pull myself up by the bootstraps and wonder out into the world to find something to give me a spark and some hope in living a normal, productive life. Maybe a job or a girlfriend would help. But getting into a relationship is always going to be tough for me with my illness.

Thanks for asking.

Take care.

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AS--

I'll once again ask you to consider, if you continue to feel down, one of the serotonin blockers (Remeron/mirtazapine or trazodone). This is, of course, at the sole discretion of yourself and your PDoc. I'm not a doctor, and I carry no right to tell you what to and what not to take. I can only make recommendations from my own experience.

The receptors blocked by those two meds often play a part in anxiety (for reference, trazodone blocks 5HT2/serotonin-2 and mirtazapine blocks 5HT2 as well as 5HT3/serotonin-3).

Some researchers hypothesize that serotonin getting into those two "bad guy" receptors (especially 5HT2) is the reason for initial suicidality seen in SSRI use, and also the potential cause of SSRIs' anxiety and sexual side effects. I'll pull out research article citations if you want them.

Otherwise, your current meds might get you better, along with what you suggested. Best of luck either way.

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I know whats its like to be made fun of and to go to the hospital and hear the wisecracks and being told they really dont want ya there ... Its sad but the mental health care system sometimes is very laughable....SO take it from me i have been to the hospital many of time .. when ya think ya need to go to the hospital then by all means just go ! never be afraid to break down and cry ... or by any means express emotions ..

just let it show wha and how ya feel if ya feel like shit show it ... and talk to ya docs about it if ya dont think your meds are jivin with ya then have a chat about it ... hell its our bodies we take this stuff

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