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Hi, my names Kaytee

I'm 21 and Bp. But was only recently diagnosed let me might added, and neither my Pdoc or I are very forth coming! But thatsanoyjer story,

I need to ask a very silly little question thats bugging me, ho would YOU define paranoia? People these days throe the term out far to loosely without lookimg at its definition?

I as far as i was concerned have been feeling realing paranoid, and the one or two friends who I actually still let see me have been commenting on th (again they haven;t read the definition)

I don't thin't they want to hhurt me in the sense,bubgen me with a knife.

I do constantly feel like people are looking at me.

Taliking about me.

I manage to have world war 5 with at lest 6 different people a week, yet I won't have seen then and they won;t be any the wiser

I'm constly listenly listening to others conversations to see if they are talking badly about me? I'll be literrally pressed against doorss

I can't eat in public places. cause I feel people will look at me

I can't sit on a couch with a group of people without feeling that theres this tension and it often boils done to me.

I never leave my flat anynore, and heavon forbid someone come.

Bascilly?

What is paranoid? Beside the hurt thing?

Oh ya and one other thing, when they say rate it on a scale og one to ten, it really freaks me out.

Who am I to say what one and whats ten?

Ok maybe they might mean for you, your ten, and one but still, it freaks me out.

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I totally get that but I don't know the answer. I always thought I had a problem with authority. I always think they are out to get me or treating me worse than everyone else. If I was asked to help cover a shift on a holiday then they were taking advantage of me. My supervisor hates me for no reason etc. The big one is that I always think I am on the verge of getting fired, no matter how wonderful my performance reviews have been. Earlier this year I did get put on probation because I was slacking during my last depression. So does that mean I wasn't being paranoid?

You aren't paranoid if they are really out to get you.

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examples:

I'll feel like people are talking about me sometimes or looking at me. Complete strangers, for no real reason other than we happen to be in the same vacinity. There are times when I am in a store, for example that I feel a certain person or certain people are there as special types of people. It's hard to explain what type of people I think they are but I guess the closest thing would be spies of some sort. That they are there for reasons other than to just shop. That when they are talking on their cellphone it isn't just to their girlfriend but that it is to another spy about their next "move". Weird conspiracy type stuff I guess. Sometimes I really pay attention to these people because of it. I have in the past thought that my friends were trying to control me in a way.

It bothers me sometimes. Because part of me says it's stupid but part of me can't help but think and do these things.

I'll get paranoid that cars are following me or that someone is in my house or just outside of it waiting to break in [that is a big one]. It can get so bad that I will stay in my room all night even if I have to go to the bathroom.

It's better now for the most part., but sometimes the people following me or someone being in/around my house is still a problem. And paranoia in general can get better or worse just like anything else.

It's hard to explain what it really is other than to give examples.

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I get paranoid all the time. The government is after me and bugged my room with mind reading devices and a listening device. It scares me every time I see a government car. I believe that I killed 350,000 people with my dreams. I caused the tsunami back in 2004 that killed 230,000 people and an earthquake that killed 80,000. I caused many other disasters in the world and this is why they are after me. I also believe that people are talking about me and my thoughts are broadcast to everyone around me. This is why I don't like crowds. I have multiple personalities and the government is controlling me and causing the personalities for entertainment. They have a whole team of people just to do this to me. See, one of the personalities is a bird and I believe I can fly in that mode, so I think the government such as the FBI or CIA put that thought in my head. The entire situation really freaks me out. Paranoia is scary. But mine is real. I feel it. It explains everything.

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thanx guys!

know its a weird question,

just still trying to work things out for myself, had a rough couple of weeks and lately just become a little over welling.

Not not so good at telling the pdoc whats wrong if I know I'm right.

I'm always determined people will think i'm lying?

So trying to get the facts straight!

And a little nervous cause I'm about to be discharged from hospital today, and feel like nothing was accomplished cause I ended up communicating.

Too scared of my Pdoc, think i need another!!!!!

Thank You!!!!!! tho millions.

I'll try x10000000000 to gather my thought ;)

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What you are talking about certainly fits what *I* would consider classic signs of paranoia. It's an icky thing, to be sure.

However, based on the way you describe your feelings, I also see the possibility of some sort of social anxiety. It would seem that a lot of these thoughts/concerns seem to center on your self--by which I mean your perception of your self and how others perceive you. A sense of people judging you constantly sort of thing.

However that is just my sense, from how you've worded it. Let's see, maybe we can try some clarification? (btw, I partially bring it up thusly because today I was in a training session at work--one of the things we did was to try to communicate by giving a partner instructions on how to draw a picture we held, with no hints and they couldn't ask questions. My partner *almost* drew the van. You don't want to know what my elephant looked like... So anyway I like to try to clarify things)

So. How do you feel, when you get the sense people are watching you etc.? Is there a sense of worthlessness, or is there something more "sinister" going on? Are you worried about how they perceive you?

Psychosis, as I understand it, can be largely shaped by one's own innate feelings--whether the delusion centers on a guv'mint conspiracy, "everyone's out to get you", or maybe you painted the Sistine Chapel--it's something in you that takes certain things that are kinda set in your head and...twists them. Could be just my thoughts, but I really do think I've seen it somewhere.

SO maybe--just maybe--you have a combo. Some self-esteem thing, taken and twisted by a misfired chemical reaction. I would hope that your pdoc would explore this--I mean, maybe you need an antipsychotic, maybe you need a benzo, maybe you just need a mood stabilizer. It may be the long way around, but IMO it would be better to start you off simple (mood stabilizer) and see what happens.

Finally: scale of one to ten? Very subjective. I just read an article on pain management, and compared it to my own experience with surgery etc. last year. My 5 might be your 8 (considering that 10 is the worst pain you can imagine). But it also turns out that women have, for whatever reason, more...pain receptors, nerve endings? I forget. Anyways, it helps to define the scale to YOUR criteria, or at least kinda cement the basic criteria so you have a reference point. Make it understandable to yourself; otherwise it's totally useless.

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I'm going to delineate what I have personally found are two general categories of paranoia (these have both been discussed on here previously, too):

1) "Neurotic" (hyperbolic) paranoia: Consists of suspicions that people are "out to get you", talking behind your back, etc. These suspicions have been raised, however, from logical reasons (i.e., said people really do dislike you and would have reason to get you or talk about you behind your back). However, you exaggerate the probability of being betrayed, as said people are very unlikely to take the effort to do anything significant, or even talk behind your back. I have this kind of paranoia... my neuropsych terms it "pre-psychosis" and says it's very common in MDD and BP's depressive phases. I would bet anything that social anxiety fits into this kind.

2) "Psychotic" (random/classic) paranoia: What most of us think of when "paranoia" is mentioned. The feeling that totally random entities (normally the government) are after you. Thoughts of mind control and thought broadcasting. Thoughts of strangers judging you at random.

I've always felt that paranoia is sort of a continuum though, it's just sort of subjective where guarded thoughts become "neurotic" and then "psychotic" paranoia.

Quoting a former pdoc of mine: "Well, it's not actually paranoia when it turns out they actually are out to get you..."

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hey

ya thats really helpful,

I really know what you might mean about the sounding like it could be a little of an insecurity thing and social anxiety. Which I don't doubt for a second I haveto a definate degree, I'm a recovered AN , as much as one ever is, my mothers. (my Dads BPII.) And so that feeling is so familar to me.

But when peoples eyes are like daggers, they pieceing, almost burn your skin. I need to get away. Its not just judgement. It doesn't make me feel bad about myself but it definatly makes my hair prickle and my skin go cold.

And I keep thinking people are mad with me and fighting with me, the ones I haven't seen in months? Saw one the other day and sprinted so fast it was undelievable, did find a good look out spot to check her out.

was so scared of another friend(one of my closet) when she gave me a lift in her car, I had i squish myself against the car door, I couldn't look at her or talk to her. She thinks I'm acting a little different? she took me to the pdoc tho.

but im not very good at talking causes im scared of him.

I'm on 200mg topamax, 200mg seroquel,

I havent really explained all this proply but he gave me

extra 0.5mg rivotril twice daily for 4 days

zoplimed 7.5mg for 10 days - never sleep

and what I'm most worried about is Concerta 18mg for concertration - I don't think 'm explaning myself very well at all.

Very concerned? I barely sleep already won't the concerta make it worse? and its just quite random, dn't think he got me. but thats my fault im not very clear?

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hey

ya thats really helpful,

I really know what you might mean about the sounding like it could be a little of an insecurity thing and social anxiety. Which I don't doubt for a second I haveto a definate degree, I'm a recovered AN , as much as one ever is, my mothers. (my Dads BPII.) And so that feeling is so familar to me.

But when peoples eyes are like daggers, they pieceing, almost burn your skin. I need to get away. Its not just judgement. It doesn't make me feel bad about myself but it definatly makes my hair prickle and my skin go cold.

And I keep thinking people are mad with me and fighting with me, the ones I haven't seen in months? Saw one the other day and sprinted so fast it was undelievable, did find a good look out spot to check her out.

was so scared of another friend(one of my closet) when she gave me a lift in her car, I had i squish myself against the car door, I couldn't look at her or talk to her. She thinks I'm acting a little different? she took me to the pdoc tho.

but im not very good at talking causes im scared of him.

I'm on 200mg topamax, 200mg seroquel,

I havent really explained all this proply but he gave me

extra 0.5mg rivotril twice daily for 4 days

zoplimed 7.5mg for 10 days - never sleep

and what I'm most worried about is Concerta 18mg for concertration - I don't think 'm explaning myself very well at all.

Very concerned? I barely sleep already won't the concerta make it worse? and its just quite random, dn't think he got me. but thats my fault im not very clear?

i can very much relate to what you've been talking about.

it sounds like there's a lot of different med stuff going on. how much rivotril (clonazepam) were you on before?

you're on seroquel. do you know if that's for bp stuff, or is dr. trying to help with thought stuff? maybe because you're having trouble making yourself clear, talking to him, he is picking up on more of what you're experiencing than you might think?

the best thing is to try and tell the dr. what's going on -- like maybe write it down? do you work with him in english? do you have a different language as your first language (afrikaans or?) and do you think that could be a factor in being able to communicate with him?

i think that it can be very tricky to figure out whether the paranoia comes out of social anxiety, or if the anxiety comes out of paranoia about people. sometimes i get paranoid about animals too. like the squirrels are out to get me (sometimes they act funny). but i definitely have triggers around people, especially groups of people, i think it relates back to the difficulties i had as a pre-teen and earlier with groups of kids. i always feel, like in malls, that their laughing is at me, and that their movements have to be watch closely at the same time as i can't look at any of them because then they will 'know'.

good luck to you

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i just wasn't sure about the english because you are from south africa. my south african friends however do speak english, so i wasn't really making the assumption that you didn't speak english as your first language. some of your writing is different from western writing, but really you are generally communicating here quite well.

i don't think you should blame yourself so hard for not being able to express what's going on for you. like, 'it's my fault' i think ignores the fact that some of your symptoms make it difficult to express yourself. the harder you are on yourself for that, the more impossible i think it will be for you to actually tell the people helping you what's wrong.

i hope that makes sense.

pj

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Ya you might have to forgive me on that one!!

Very English! But do throw in the, ya ect, very south african

Just very very dyslexic! Need to stop and read what i write sometimes!!!! ;)

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true

maybe its not, maybe i need a name tag.

I don't feel right. I cant talk about it.

I'm terrified of Pdoc, I think if i tell him things he'll think I'm lying and will be angry with me.

I'm nervous writting here.

I just don't see the piont.

i can't do this.

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true

maybe its not, maybe i need a name tag.

I don't feel right. I cant talk about it.

I'm terrified of Pdoc, I think if i tell him things he'll think I'm lying and will be angry with me.

I'm nervous writting here.

I just don't see the piont.

i can't do this.

hang in there Kaytee! you are admitting stressul thoughts here, you CAN find your way about this

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Just a quick thought--Seroquel at 200 mg? That's about what I used to take...to go to sleep.

My thought...is that, if these feelings are to be quelled by an AP, a higher dosage would be good. If that doesn't work, move on to the next, etc.. This generally seems to have worked for my fiancee...seroquel, zyprexa, risperdal, abilfy...then bam, more or less, geodon has seemed to work.

While this is truly stressful, don't worry, there IS an answer out there. I just personally feel that, as far as these generally paranoid thoughts go, you're not yet being treated, well...aggressively enough. I just don't think 200 mg of seroquel is really therapeutic (unless you've got insomnia...)

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Just wanted to agree with CNS, 200mg of Seroquel probably isn't enough to do anything for your paranoia. If it is being caused by bipolar mania, which there is a decent chance it is, the lowest therapeutic dose for controlling mania is usually 400mg if memory serves right and most people need at least 600mg. For me, the magic number seems to be 800mg and even then I still have some breakthrough every once and awhile.

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Just to reiterate and enlarge upon what I wrote in reply to your blog: everything you write sounds just like me at your age, without the self harm. One thing you really can't afford to do is let it get worse - if you believe people are out to get you and/or are in consipracy behind your back (trust me they aren't - at least I'm not and I'm sure many people here will assert the same!) , you will have a hard time accepting any help and it could drag out into further misery. While you still have a little respect for your pdoc (and I very much doubt he is out to get you - these people work long hours in a stressful job that they have usually signed up for in order to help people like you, not just for the money) then I think writing a list of your anxieties is a good idea. If you can make 20 or so observations on your worst insecurities/paranoias/worries/stresses/whatever then that should help enormously.

My gut is feeling is with crazynotstupid: you need a higher dose of seroquel or another anti-psychotic. But I'm not a professional and know nothing about you other than what you have written here. So, like Karuna warned me (or maybe I being paranoid, hah), I wont try and label your condition or do anything other than guess at what might help.

And I agree with the comment about self-esteem. I can totally relate. Low self-esteem spiralling towards paranoia is a rough trip. I think you should still be in hospital and in conversation with professionals everyday in a bid to put a stop to this as soon as possible and engage with reality "properly".

In the meantime, try and stay cool and take whatever comfort you can from simple pleasures I guess. If you are going through anything like what I did then it is truly the worst. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

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Hey ;)

I'm back! Its taken me to 5.05 am in the morming to get the guts to check your replies!

Was trying to work out how to delet myself off this thing.

was tad nervious, but thanx, actually not so bad. Thank you again!

But definatly going to make a list. Cause between the two of us we getting nowherre where and its not his fault.

and definately needto talk to him about the sleep thing thoght going nuts :)

but one more question? i was in hospital till 2 days ago just for 5 days because i "weird" aand they where worried i hurt myself, but pdoc thought it was study related- (I'm doing a hard coare medical degree, but laterly i don

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