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There are actually quite a few of us.  I think the fact that this is a spirituality board might have dissuaded some from coming here.  For many people, Sprituality = Christianity.  Not true, but still... 

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Let me say one thing up front:  this thread is not for discussion of whether or not magick is real.  It's not for people who want to brand all occultists as Satanists or lunatics.  Anybody and everybody is welcome to participate in the conversation, but please play nice and respect the beliefs of others.

Thank you.

I think the fact that this is a spirituality board might have dissuaded some from coming here.  For many people, Sprituality = Christianity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're probably right.  I thought it was worth a try, though.  ;)

I'm more Christan, but I do really like reverance for nature most occult pracitioners have.

Sorry if I'm confusing Magick and Wiccan, I really don't know much about these things.

Magick is seperate from religion.  There are Christian magicians, Jewish ones, Wiccan ones, and those (like me) who are more or less agnostic.  Pretty much every religion/nonreligion has its occultists, from tribal shamans to atheists.

I can certainly admire a revernce for nature, though.  My kid sister's a Wiccan.  :)

So what would you like to know? :>

The discussion I'm interested in having is how mental illness and magick connect (or disconnect).

For example: Several years ago I had a deeply moving event happen atop a Seminole burial mound.  My father's American Indian, so I felt a connection to the place.  I saw and heard things.  Was it supernatural, was it a psychotic break, and does it even matter which of the two it was?  I don't think it matters.  I had an experience and it taught me a number of things about myself, so its source is unimportant to me.

Also: A number of well-known magicians over the years have either been crazy or else gone crazy.  I find the connection fascinating.  Does mental illness make one more likely to accept alternate ways of dealing with reality, or does the alternate realities of magick drive magicians crazy?

In my own experience, I've found that I can't do magick when I'm being mentally interesting.  I don't have the focus for it.  When I've tried, I've fucked things up royally or else made myself go ever crazier.  I really think a major breakdown I had was in part kick-started by a working gone awry.  (Long story involving pissing off an Enochian angel -- was not the brightest thing I've ever done.)

Anyway, I'd be interested in hearing others' opinions and experiences.

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Well, I'm sure as most of the regular board members know by now, I'm Wiccan.  I do go to church though because it's the one thing that my mother and I do to keep our relationship together (being that we had one hell of a bad one from the day I was born).  But I'm a proud Wiccan and do believe in a God and Goddess.  I used to be a High Priestess for a coven, but since my members all went off to college or have moved out of town, I'm back to being a Solitary Witch.

Funny you should bring that up, I have a friend who thought anyone who was mentally ill all practiced some kind of religion other than Christianity.  That was just his opinion though. 

Elizabeth

my magickal name is Amethyst Rose Silver Moon

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I too consider myself a witch ( more on this at http://www.crazyboards.org/index.php?showtopic=2156).  I refuse to attribute this to any MI on my part.  I have found that I am extremely sensitive to the energy around me, it is an almost visibly tangible force.  This sensitivity is something that I must pay careful attention to, because I have found it to have a very powerful effect on my mental state.

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I've been practicing Wicca for 18 years now. 

I refuse to attribute this to any MI on my part.  I have found that I am extremely sensitive to the energy around me, it is an almost visibly tangible force.  This sensitivity is something that I must pay careful attention to, because I have found it to have a very powerful effect on my mental state.

Even though my friend thinks that it's some kind of "thing" for people with MI to practice different religions other than Christianity, I feel the same as disphunkt.

I was raised in a Methodist church and still go there to bond with my mother, but feel more attuned with nature and the practice of witchcraft than I do with traditional spirituality.  To me, witchcraft feels like coming home.  My mother may still not like the fact that I practice it, but it's who I am and I feel no guilt or shame in it.

Elizabeth 

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The discussion I'm interested in having is how mental illness and magick connect (or disconnect).

Oddly.  In many cases the two may play off of each other, sometimes destructively. However, many shamanic practices have the intent and results of healing for all involved - and for the duration the healer and/or the patient is not in hir "right state of mind".

For example: Several years ago I had a deeply moving event happen atop a Seminole burial mound.
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When my niece was a teen, she was hospitalised and diagnosed as bipolar.  While she was in the hospital, my parents, with whom she had been living, went through her things.  They found her diary.  In it, she wrote about being Wiccan, casting spells, reading the Tarot.  They told the doctor on the ward about this, and he told them that there had been an influx on teenage girls 'dabbling with the occult' in the hospital.  He basically blamed her being bipolar to her not being Christian. 

Yes, I am Pagan.  I used to be Wiccan, but my beliefs have changed over the years.  I do not blame my being MI on my sprituality.  My sprituality helps me cope. 

As Arthur C. Clarke said: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."  It's my belief that what we now call magic(k), the future will know as a branch of science. 

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I used to be a High Priestess for a coven, but since my members all went off to college or have moved out of town, I'm back to being a Solitary Witch.

Being solitary is hard work.  My closest magician friend lives about three hours away.  We mostly keep in touch by email, which sucks.

Funny you should bring that up, I have a friend who thought anyone who was mentally ill all practiced some kind of religion other than Christianity.  That was just his opinion though. 

Bizarre.  Mental illness as cult.  I find the idea kind of amusing, actually.  ;)

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Actually, I see no need to restrict the content of threads, although if we pick up a wild tangent, I may move it to its own thread.

What I'm afraid of is getting into arguments over whether or not what I believe in is valid.  I hate arguing.  ;)

I would never go into a Christian discussion thread and start insulting or questioning their beliefs, unless that's what the thread was about.  It's rude.

We in large part rely on the consensus of those around us to determine what is real.  It is generally conceded that apples are red.  But is that a mere illusion?  Certain flowers appear pure white, but in spectra we cannot see they actually have distinctive markings.  So, are they marked or not? 

Exactly.

One of the few tenets of chaos magick (my particular branch) is that "nothing is true; everything is permitted."  So everything can be true and not true at the same time.  It doesn't matter if a spiritual experience is a delusion or a real happening.  The fact is, it happened.  Rituals that work just work, whether it's coincidence or altered thinking or real supernatural intervention.

However, it can be great fun to speculate as to the nature of things...

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My suspicion from this is that your training, self-taught or guided, leans more to towards the structured, "High Ceremonial", side of things. Being mentally interesting may hinder your practice because you "know" you need to gather the appropriate materials at a proper time and in the right frame of mind. With that type of working, a loss of focus can cause the entire house of cards that you ARE building in your psyche to come tumbling down. And guess whose head they land in, sharp edges down.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, I'm a chaote.  I can do simple things like sigils and such even when I'm off my rocker, and they work fine.  You're right, though, it's the high ceremonial stuff that goes wonky when I'm mad.  I was going through a Goetic period when I lost my marbles...

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I've read alot.  I've met many people who practice different faiths.  The terms change but the intent does not.  These are my thoughts on Magik.

Is Magik real?  Yes.  What is Magik?

We are magical (i.e. spiritual) beings.  Our thoughts, what we do, become to a large part our reality.  I like Carlos Castenda's book "The Power Of Silence".  By silencing our own mind/ego we become aware of the wonderful, magikal world that surounds us.  Sometimes we may even see the threads that connect us all.

A very Wise Witch once told me that everything you do comes back to you three fold, be it good or bad.

While I don't practice the "arts" per say, I don't see much difference between a Wiccan and a Christian.  This may sound strange.  They believe differently.  One may hate and condem the other, and vise versa.  They want to change reality, usually for the better.  Their methods are different.  But each individual is made of the same stuff.  We were all created from the same source.  The power of prayer has been proven.  I think that the power of spell has also been proven.  Different methodologies. I admire Earth centered religions for their reverence of life.  I admire Christianity for it's reverence of life.

Can someone else's negativity effect other's?  Sure.  Can you protect yourself from this? Yes.

In the George Lucas movies, the Force, Jedi, Sith, are fiction but they can be used as analogies for spirituality.

When you act out of love and self-less ness you create goodness and life.  When you act out of greed and selfishness, you create more of the same.

These are only my thoughts...

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While I might read alot, I don't believe everything I read.

I trust my inner knower, if you know what I mean.

That inner knower, or intuition, is rarely wrong if you can feel it without letting your own thoughts, feelings get in the way.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I was going through a Goetic period when I lost my marbles...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The assigning of "cause" and "effect" are best left to the Dear Reader who knows what Cali's talking about, realize that asking "Why?" is at best rhetorical, wouldn't be surprised either way, and could probably name examples in both cases...

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The assigning of "cause" and "effect" are best left to the Dear Reader who knows what Cali's talking about, realize that asking "Why?" is at best rhetorical, wouldn't be surprised either way, and could probably name examples in both cases...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

*laugh*  Why do you think I phrased it that way?

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Lisa,

Did the lady at the crystal shop tell you how to charge your crystal?  Just wondering.  I've been drawn to certain crystals all thoughout my years of being a witch.  One in particular actually came to me by accident.  And a psychic told me I was like this stone.  I was like, excuse me, I'm not sure what you mean.  He said, you're like the stone Jade.  You have a passionate side that needs to be molded in order for someone to see the true beauty the lies beneath the stone.  When I came home, I looked up the stone in my one crystal book and also found out the Jade is also known as the "Stone of the Flank" In other words, Jade also found me through my kidney problems.  I was totally blown away!  One day, when I do have some extra money, I have my eye on a lilac Jade necklace in The Pyramid Collection Cataloge.  I never knew Jade came in lilac, but it does.  Before my sister gave up her path in Wicca, she was the crystal expert.  I'm the tarot expert and I'm slowly working on crystals.  She was kind enough to give me her crystals.  If you need to know how to charge your crystal, let me know.

Word of advice, if you ever lose your crystal, just remember, it was meant to be.  Silver RavenWolf, my favorite Wiccan author, says that losing a crystal is a sign that someone else is meant to find it because they need it.  I've lost a lot of Amber necklaces, Amethysts, Rose Quartz and Turquoise. 

Elizabeth

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Lisa,

Charging is the same as blessing.  So you're all set.  My best friend actually got me a bottle of ocean water for me for the next time I "charge" my crystals or use it for during a ritual, which I want to include him in, of course.  It's silly seeing a bottle of Sprite with sand and broken shells in my altar, knowing full well that it's ocean water and sand from South Carolina.  *laughs*

PS I liked your point about losing crystals... my husband relocated countries (continents in fact!) to be with me and left many crystals behind that he'd meant to bring with him.  The lady in the shop also told him to consider it as something that was meant to be.  Interestingly - though on a slightly different tack - the day he arrived here (we'd been separated for nearly 4 months) a necklace he'd been wearing for protection shattered... within an hour of walking into the apartment, it fell off his neck.  We still haven't found all the beads and stones, but we both saw it as very much a sign that he'd come home and was safe.

How true...how very true.

Elizabeth

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Hello you all:

I'm not a Witch, but I have great respect for those that follow that path.  One thing that has impressed me with talking to those who practice Wiccan, is their knowlege of oils and crystals.

I like quartz crystals.  They are used in watches, lasers, and are used by people for protection, cleansing of energy fields, and as helpers in spell casting.

I cleanse my quartz crystals with nothing but sunshine on clear days.

I also like silver.  Silver necklaces and medallions.

I pray over my "stuff" and use them to help cleanse myself and my environment from negativity.

What other cystals are good for cleansing your own energy field and the energy fields of your immediate surroundings?

Thanks for your help.

P.S. How do you protect yourself from mirrors?

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Not really sure where this belongs, but I'd like to put it under this thread, if nobody minds..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nobody minds.  Or at least, I don't mind.  ;)

I have this weird attraction to garnets...  It's not my birthstone or anything, I just feel drawn to them.  My engagement ring is a purple garnet, set in silver with gold...

Speaking of jewelry -- my husband and I had a jeweler friend (who also happens to be a chaote) make rings with sigils worked into them.  So everybody who looks at the rings (and they do get a lot of attention, being unique and, I think, beautiful) charges the sigils for us.  That same friend, along with his wife, performed our wedding ceremony last Halloween, and they did a fantastic job.

Here's a photo of the rings:

rings_closeup.jpg

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Caligatia:  I may have wrongly attempted to ask questions on this thread.  I'm not sure what you mean by the "Occult".  It's a broad term.  Do you mean just Witchcraft an Wizardry in their many forms?  The "Occult", according to dictionary.com means:

# Of, relating to, or dealing with supernatural influences, agencies, or phenomena.

# Beyond the realm of human comprehension; inscrutable.

# Available only to the initiate;

While I've only been initiated into the Catholic Church, I find that I meet the above two references.

The Church is all about rituals...

That is probably why I see that their use is so wide spread in every religion or spiritual practice.

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I may have wrongly attempted to ask questions on this thread.

You can't wrongly attempt to ask questions on any of our boards.  Threre's no such thing as a foolish question if you don't know the answer.  Ask away!

Cerberus

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Guest Skittle unlogged

my husband and I had a jeweler friend (who also happens to be a chaote) make rings with sigils worked into them

Caligatia-- the rings are really beautiful -- thanks for sharing the pic.  We don't have formal rings ourselves yet (we have only had a civil wedding; are planning a blessing ceremony later in the year when we're financially (and mentally-- heh) more stable), but also have some ideas of designs to use.  I'm very much drawn to some of the old celtic knots.

Can you tell me exactly what a sigil is?  Is it a specific symbol?

Lisa

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Caligatia:  I may have wrongly attempted to ask questions on this thread.  I'm not sure what you mean by the "Occult".  It's a broad term.  Do you mean just Witchcraft an Wizardry in their many forms?  The "Occult", according to dictionary.com means:

# Of, relating to, or dealing with supernatural influences, agencies, or phenomena.

# Beyond the realm of human comprehension; inscrutable.

# Available only to the initiate;

While I've only been initiated into the Catholic Church, I find that I meet the above two references.

The Church is all about rituals...

That is probably why I see that their use is so wide spread in every religion or spiritual practice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"Witchcraft and Wizardry" -- you a Harry Potter fan?  *grin*

Seriously, though, you're welcome to ask questions here.  By "occult" I meant the practice of magick and related things.  Although rituals like those of the Catholic Church are a kind of magick, themselves.  They operate along the same principles -- i.e., doing certain things by which to gain the notice/favor of a spiritual entity (in this case, God) and help those participating in the ritual to feel closer to said entity.

I think I just said something blasphemous, but really -- the principle is the same.  ;)

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Can you tell me exactly what a sigil is?  Is it a specific symbol?

A sigil is a symbol, made up by an individual, that represents a concept or desire.

For example, I could take the phrase "I am healthy" (which expresses my desire to be healthy) and make a sigil out of the phrase by artistically combining and simplifying the letters which make up the phrase.  (It's also possible to make musical sigils and other things, but right now I'm talking about written symbols.)

Once the sigil is created, it is "charged" like a battery -- via extreme emotion of some sort (like sexual release) or by having as many people as possible view the sigil.  You don't have to know what it means in order to charge it.  It just works.  In fact, you try to forget the sigil entirely once it's charged.

The sigils on our wedding rings are for various good things to happen to keep my marriage going.  Things like "we will be healthy and prosperous", or whatever.  I can't tell you exactly what the sigils mean because I no longer know myself.  And this is a good thing.  I just know that they're for making the marriage go well.

If this makes no sense, I'll try and explain it better...

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Currently having a look at "Oven-Ready Chaos" by Phil Hine.  Do you know it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Phil Hine is one of the best writers on chaos magick out there.  I've read all his stuff, both the online works and the hard-copy ones.  ;)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Skittle kunzite is very delicate. Maybe charge it with sunlight or moonlight but I'm not sure about sea salt and water. I love crystals and they are very important to me. I couldn't follow wicca because I have the attention span of a fruit fly but I respect it. A good place to buy crystals online is http://www.rainbowcrystal.com/ I have loved every single thing I've gotten from them. Skaz can you explain the mirror thing. I'm dense and don't understand.

Lilie

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  • 1 month later...

Skittle kunzite is very delicate. Maybe charge it with sunlight or moonlight but I'm not sure about sea salt and water. I love crystals and they are very important to me. I couldn't follow wicca because I have the attention span of a fruit fly but I respect it. A good place to buy crystals online is http://www.rainbowcrystal.com/ I have loved every single thing I've gotten from them. Skaz can you explain the mirror thing. I'm dense and don't understand.

Lilie

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Some say that mirrors are gateways.  That is they go both ways.  Some bless and use oil to protect their mirrors from those with ill intent who are using the gate ways.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am not a practicing, but am very drawn to wicca, etc. At another forum there is a thread about talents. There were so many post about strong empathy and some mind reading. My theory is that due to our mental disability (or ability) our minds are more open and aware of other energies than many norms.

I'll step down off my soapbox now. ;)

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