Anafranil for depersonalization

[Guest Guest_Dpmommy33_*]

Hi,

I suffer from depersonalization and derealization since 4 years. I wrote on this board about stimulants I take (ritalin) and prozac, who just help for 1 hour and my addictive behavior toward it *I can take ritalin until 8. Then after, I have bad headache and feel so anxious. It's really a drug.

I don't eat well, don't sleep well so my pdoc changed my prescription. I taper off Prozac and taper slowly ritalin because I take TOOO much of it. I also take klonopin and rhovane sine 4 years, trying to taper off.

I wonder... can Anfranil at low doses help derealization? Can it be dangerous for my health (heart)? And what time the time lench before taking anafranil and tapering off prozac and ritalin? I don't want bad interactions. I also wondered about wellbutrin, because if Ritalin kind of helped derealization for 1 hour and depression, it must be because of dopamine.... I just don't know. I just know that I can't taper off klonopin at the same time I take wellbutrin because of risk of seizures.

p.s. My doctor will not say it to me, he is too old and prescribe anything and I just CANT change doctor so I really do have to be with him because of the city I live in (sectorization). I have to be my own doctor and it is scaring me.

Tks for the infos!!!

Dpmommy33

[null0trooper]

I wonder... can Anfranil at low doses help derealization? Can it be dangerous for my health (heart)? And what time the time lench before taking anafranil and tapering off prozac and ritalin? I don't want bad interactions.

clomipramine is a reuptake inhibitor for both serotonin and norepinephrine. Like many antipsychotics and tricyclic antidepressants, it also has some antihistamine/anticholinergic properties. Between those two groups of effects it might have a stabilizing effect on dopamine.

At low doses, maybe it will help. As with several of the old TCAs that still are being used your exact response is going to be somewhat unique to you. Any time you deal with a med that hits multiple receptors, multiple neurochemical systems, or both, much is going to depend on what's going on in *your* head.

At high doses it can be cardiotoxic. That's one reason doctors have shied away from tricyclics with newer meds available - an OD can be fatal.

There ARE liver enzyme interactions. clomipramine is metabolized by the 2D6 P450 isoenzyme that Wellbutrin, Paxil, Prozac, and Zoloft most strongly inhibit. However, there are a couple of other routes to clear it, so at a lower dose it's not too likely to build up dangerously. However, it's going to pack a little more punch than the same dose in folks not taking these meds

It can also adversely affect sleep structure, but the problems usually go away after 3 - 4 weeks. (mentalhealth.com )

I also wondered about wellbutrin, because if Ritalin kind of helped derealization for 1 hour and depression, it must be because of dopamine....

Um, no.

First, you are on other things that are actually used to treat depression and none of them are called "Ritalin" It's past time to stop justifying something even you admit you shouldn't be taking any longer.

Second, increased or disordered dopamine transmission is more closely tied to inducing psychosis and mania than it is to improving depressive states. For derealization tied to psychosis or dissociation, antipsychotics are more commonly used to help stabilize a patient. With derealization as a symptom of temporal lobe damage, an anticonvulsant is needed. Both are groups that stimulants aren't given to, and Wellbutrin is close to the last psych drug a doctor would give to a patient with temporal lobe seizures.

If you've never had seizures as a result of Wellbutrin in the past, you should be able to taper slowly off klonopin while on it.

[mrsloony]

I took anafranil years ago-as an AD it used to be used commonly to treat OCD. ( I had an ED which had very OCD qualities. I assumed that is why I was on it in conjunction with an SSRI.

I also have a great deal of depersonalization, dissociation etc. I've never found an AD to help with this. As null said, APs are much more helpful. But this has been a hard thing to treat- I don't think any med has really helped it that much, ( and I've been on Everything) . Maybe I just have to keep looking.

I have no idea about all the medical questions. Do you already have a heart problem? Have you had seizures or are you at high risk?

It does sound like ritalin should be the first to go as you describe such problems with it. and then see how you feel. I've know people who like provigil better than ritalin.

( though neither were helpful to me)

[null0trooper]

I also have a great deal of depersonalization, dissociation etc. I've never found an AD to help with this. As null said, APs are much more helpful. But this has been a hard thing to treat- I don't think any med has really helped it that much, ( and I've been on Everything) . Maybe I just have to keep looking.

Everything reasonable I've read on dissociation disorders indicates that intense psychotherapy is just about the only workable tool. Whatever's not working right isn't where the current crop of drugs can reach.

[mrsloony]

thanks null,

I guess I still have a hell of a lot of work to do. at least i know i'm heading in the right direction.

[Guest Guest_Dpmommy33_*]

Hi.

For responses :

At high doses it can be cardiotoxic. : Hum, I don't have heart problem but it scares me!!!!

Second, increased or disordered dopamine transmission is more closely tied to inducing psychosis and mania than it is to improving depressive states. For derealization tied to psychosis or dissociation, antipsychotics are more commonly used to help stabilize a patient. : thanks for helping me not being afraid about psichosis!! I am anxious about it, even reading the word makes me depersonalize, please don't say that to me please!!! I am stuck with ritalin, I just DONT know how to taper off slowly!!! Nobody can help?

With derealization as a symptom of temporal lobe damage, an anticonvulsant is needed. Both are groups that stimulants aren't given to, and Wellbutrin is close to the last psych drug a doctor would give to a patient with temporal lobe seizures.

I am not supposed to have TLE. Wellbutrin, well, after what you've said I would not try it.

About AP, I tried it and I felt MORE depersonalized and derealized, like a zombie. Like, way more ill. It's not for me. Sorry

reading that all meds doesn't help doesn't help me, because I still see a psychologist, and it's been 4 years. It's not enough for me. I have to deal with pstd, depression and anxiety with dp/dr. So I have to take meds. For now. I can cry really bad w/o any meds, and with klonopin I can't taper off tomorrow. I take 2 mg each day, and 2 Imovane too. Since 4 years I try to taper off those meds, and I become so nervous I can't.

About SSRI, only Paxil helped anxiety, depression and dp, but not DR. Sadly. But since I take too much ritalin to use it as an antidepressant (stop me from thinking and crying), I think I should go back on it, it's safer.

tks,

--------------------

Proof once again that we are the only adventurers for whom the letters "AD&D" stand for "Attention Deficit Disorder" - Roy Greenhilt, Order of the Stick

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mrsloony

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thanks null,

I guess I still have a hell of a lot of work to do. at least i know i'm heading in the right direction.

--------------------

dx: MDD, r/o: bp II, ptsd, gad, ibs, hypothyroid

rx: wellbutrin, lithium, seroquel, ativan, levoxl

[Guest Guest_Dpmommy33_*]

Hi,

I am damned scared of derealization now. I took too much Ritalin in the recent past, now I want to stop. I have read that ritalin has a psychological dependance, so tapering off should not be fatal for me. I will decrease quicky. I have read bad things about ritalin and the brain, and I feel like an addict with it.

I also feel MORE depressed and MORE derealized than ever when it wears off, or when I take too much of it. Or just, when I am in a public place. It doesn't help dissociation. I would like to start Anafranil bcause it says it can help depression and I am becoming plan depressive and suicidal. I just lost my job and I feel like like has no value and dissociation came back with a vengeance. I feel no self. And I have read that Anafranil CAN help derealization AND depression AND anxiety.

Do you know what washout time I should take when I finish to take Ritalin and start Anafranil (1o mg)? I don't want to die, I want to feel better and more social and not depressed. Now I am really really depressed and derealization is more present than ever.

Can someone help me and tell me really if we have to wait 3 weeks of more? How could tell me that really?

tks

Dpmommy33

Mommy of a beautiful 4 years old boy and really derealized and confused now. needs help quick.

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