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FreedomSeeker

It's Women's Faults Men Abuse Them

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...if religion is a forbidden subject then that's that.

Ah, no. There is, however a section specifically for it.

Yes. There is a section specifically for discussing religion. There is not a section for bashing others' religions nor is there one for dictating how others are to approach their own.

Also, there is a guideline which states thou shalt not be a bigger jerk than the mods, which [i believe] null thought anodyne was/is in violation of.

Quite a bit in violation thereof.

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And the whole "accept all of it" is from the bible...... (Better to be cold than lukewarm, I believe is the exact phrasing. I had the crap shoved down my throat for 20 years. I know more about Christianity than most Christians.)

While you may believe that you know more about Christianity than most Christians, what you posted was not from "the bible" but your own selected paraphrases posted as a mockery of the actual texts. Verses that fail to support your position or which contradict it were conveniently left out of your commentary. The truth is that you are guilty of the exact same selective misinterpretation of holy writ that the referenced preacher was guilty of.

This is not the place to do that.

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I'd just like to invite everyone who wants to have a discussion about religion to come on down to the Spirituality board and let's talk! I like debates about religion and theology, as long as we can be civil about it.

olga

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If it's that important to include all the verses, then I'll reference Revelation 3:14-22 for the whole cold/lukewarm thing.

Also, if I would have put verses that say to respect your wife too, then well, I'd be accused of starting trouble by pointing out the inconsistencies in the bible.

(And just in case it wasn't clear, the whole "protestants are lax" thing was sarcasm with a smile. In case there was any specific offense taken to that... I didn't mean it to be derrogatory.)

Edited by Anodyne Oblivion

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My parents raised me to never engage in discussions about religion, politics, or money. Despite my participation in a recent very flaming post (btw, sorry.) about money, I try to stick to that golden rule. Even here, maybe it is a good thing. Can you imagine how bad a discussion of politics could be? Yikes. Money, yeah, opinions/whatever differ. Religion is a very personal thing that could insult people easily without anyone meaning to.

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I have very strong views about religion, to say the least.

However, I also live in America, and after they wrote the Constitution, the Frmaers made some Amendments, the very first of which had to do with freedom of speech and oh yeah, religion. I disagree with one HELL of a lot of what goes on with religion and the lack of these days, but the very variety of it and the allowing of it is a HUGE part of what makes this country great and strong.

I sure could denigrate other religions, or offshoots of Christianity. It would be very easy for me to go off about heathens and heretics. But I try not to; if I don't respect another's religion (or lack of) then I can't expect them to respect mine. Of course, it rather pisses me off to see people here spitting on the generality of my faith, but I'm used to it, so I try not to spit right back.

Anyways. This probably should have started out on the Spirituality board as it was (just cuz it's in the news doesn't make it a "News" thing). It's definately turned out that way. So "poof", there it goes...

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hi,

going way back....i have an ex-h who qualifies for a "stoning."

and i would LOVE to be separated from everyone when im "unclean." i could use the quiet and rest.

db

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yes, but now all of sudden we're not as contentious about it.

is it just me, or does anyone else wonder about the kind of man who NEEDS a doctrine to back him up when he decides to abuse his wife? like, what kind of pussy needs a how-to guide and a motivational manual when he decides to smack someone around?

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If it's that important to include all the verses, then I'll reference Revelation 3:14-22 for the whole cold/lukewarm thing.

It is not a quotation if you do not use the same words (allowing for accurate translation) as the author. If you do not understand that we have no basis for discussion.

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is it just me, or does anyone else wonder about the kind of man who NEEDS a doctrine to back him up when he decides to abuse his wife? like, what kind of pussy needs a how-to guide and a motivational manual when he decides to smack someone around?

I think you're really misunderstanding this...as usual.

Obviously, no one needs a how-to guide or any sort of motivation. It takes some sort of thick-headedness to spit that out.

This sort of thinking, about sin and abuse, comes from (to my thought) a need of absolution--a need to forgive the nigh unforgivable.

There are those who, I guess, just don't understand domestic abuse, don't understand the trauma it brings.

And then there are those that just don't understand true forgiveness.

And then there's those that just like to point and shout and think they know what they're talking about.

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okay.....

well, as usual, you don't seem to understand sarcasm, or snarkiness, as much as you praise it to the skies from your buddies, when *i* let fly with some deranged sarcasm you for some godawful reason think i'm being dead-on serious.

what, do i have quotes from Andrea Dworkin or something hidden somewhere on my profile that i don't know about?

geez goddamn louise, do i have to litter every fucking post with those damn emoticons just so CNS can figure out what the fuck i mean? it was hyperbole, dammit! exxageration for the sake of making a point! pushing a comparison to the point of ridiculousness!

and the point i *was* making...(in a very serious voice and small words for CNS): i have a personal philosophy that people who who batter down and abuse others, verbally, emotionally, physically, have such small and damaged senses of themselves (whoops! big words) that they NEED to grind another person into small small pieces to bolster their self esteem. i was attempting to insinuate (oh, fuck it, i'll use big words. i like them.) that the guy who uses religious doctrine to give him an excuse to do so was so low in intelligence and courage that he needed someone to give him (or her...there's a lot of hers) a religious rationale, instead of just having enough cojones to think "i'm gonna smack someone around because i want to, and i deserve to smack someone around". hiding behind God's imaginary skirt is well, rather cowardly.

there. that's my point. not a misunderstanding, but simply a different viewpoint. and i'm getting really fucking tired of being told that i 'misunderstand' when the reality is i DISAGREE with you. really really fucking tired.

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hi all:

CNS wrote:

This sort of thinking, about sin and abuse, comes from (to my thought) a need of absolution--a need to forgive the nigh unforgivable.

There are those who, I guess, just don't understand domestic abuse, don't understand the trauma it brings.

And then there are those that just don't understand true forgiveness.

i think im missing the whole point of this post. domestic abuse = trauma, but we are to forgive the abuser?

hell no!!! if someone abuses me, my baby, my family, my friends, even strangers - I will have that person arrested.

i dont have to forgive anyone for anything. and yes, i realize that i will live with this "non-forgiveness" my whole life. and i'll probably become a mean old spinster living in the basement of my brother's house. i'll let the forgiving be god's problem.

db

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what, do i have quotes from Andrea Dworkin or something hidden somewhere on my profile that i don't know about?

Evan Dorkin would be more interesting, and CB-appropriate as well!

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hi all:

CNS wrote:

This sort of thinking, about sin and abuse, comes from (to my thought) a need of absolution--a need to forgive the nigh unforgivable.

There are those who, I guess, just don't understand domestic abuse, don't understand the trauma it brings.

And then there are those that just don't understand true forgiveness.

i think im missing the whole point of this post. domestic abuse = trauma, but we are to forgive the abuser?

hell no!!! if someone abuses me, my baby, my family, my friends, even strangers - I will have that person arrested.

No one's asking that someone not be arrested in such a situation. Having someone arrested now is different from forgiving them later--or even forgiving them as they're being hauled off in cuffs.

Or, sometimes, you have someone else arrested cuz the person they abused has already forgiven them.

i dont have to forgive anyone for anything. and yes, i realize that i will live with this "non-forgiveness" my whole life. and i'll probably become a mean old spinster living in the basement of my brother's house. i'll let the forgiving be god's problem.

That's all well and good. Just realize that other people do forgive. They even find it pretty easy to do so. Funny thing, it can be far harder for the abuser to forgive themselves than for the abused to do the forgiving.

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I just want to say, I wasn't trying to start a debate about Christianity or any other religion when I started this thread. I was just appalled at the so-called "scholar" in the article. I don't think he speaks for all Christians (certainly not any I know), but even if he hadn't been religious, I'd have posted just because he's such an idiot.

As for the topic title, that was out of sarcasm, not meant to offend anyone.

Personally, I have a lot of issues with Christianity, along with other religions, but I don't think everyone of those religions are bad people. As long as you don't try to push your beliefs on me, including and especially through laws, I won't push mine on you.

I'm sorry if my original post led to angry posts, but it was not my intent.

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Sorry guys I've been checking on you from time to time and couldn't help myself. I hope I'm not treading on toes, but it's cold here in 'downunder' now, so a bit of a warming might be welcome.

Hmm...sounds like we're all screwed no matter what. Good thing I'm not a Christian.

Well. Guess all Christians just suck, huh? One petty little guy speaks, the whole flock must follow, eh?

Must be nice, living in that little world... (actually listening to people these days,

Yes it seems that if one person contradicts Christianity then Christianity is no good, but if 99 confirm Christianity then they are misled.

This is one of the many reasons why I can't take Christianity seriously, as its adherents tend cherry pick the parts of the Bible that reinforce their agenda and disregard or ignore the parts that don't.

I'm sorry but you can't say that I have to do something because the Bible says so, but even though the Bible says not to do something else (i.e.: eat shellfish) it's okay to do those things anyway. Can't God make up His omnipotent mind?

Seems to be a bit contradictory! Is the second paragraph an example for the first?

had died, & he wasn't supposed to. they HAD to solve that problem).

He suffered and died to show us that suffering & death is a fact of life and that he would not ask those he loves to endure pain and death without doing it himself!

(as interpreted by various petty guys)

oh, yeah, i agree on that one. but really, show me a religion or institution or government that doesn't have that problem? it seems to be a universal issue with us humans...we always get some power-hungry charismatic bozo that usurps a good idea and corrupts it. Islam is being destroyed in this manner...

Reddog rocks!

One petty little guy speaks, the whole flock must follow, eh?

isn't this pretty much the basis for Roman Catholicism? the Pope has advisors, yes, but he makes all the final decisions, correct? at least i'm from a Democratic religious background...

I

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Squee! HLS is back. this thread really has the potential to go south into name calling or turn into a great conversation. i vote for good conversation. i'll bake cookies.

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Let's just say I have a very personal beef with religion.

If you don

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It was hard to get the quote- unquote balanced. Maybe I need to give my post a mood stabiliser.

Do we seriously need a play-by-play in this thread?

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Squee! HLS is back. this thread really has the potential to go south into name calling or turn into a great conversation. i vote for good conversation. i'll bake cookies.

I should have known better than to write here. I don't think that it's very likely for the last part Reddog! The odds here are greatly in favour of the former but not from me!

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