why do pdocs go higher and higher with antipsychotics?

[crywolf2010]

i got schizo. ive seen about 3-4 pdocs since being diagnosed. had to change coz i moved to different areas. anyway each one i saw kept giving me ridiculous amounts of antipsychotic. ill give you an example one had me on 50mg of zyprexa another one had me on 1600mg of seroquel another 900mg clozapine another 320mg of zeldox. all high doses or beyond the max dose. i met this guy in a pscy ward that was taking 40mg of lexapro and i "think" the max is meant to be 20mg! the pdocs know you cant cure it but they keep going higher and higher. can this cause any brain damage? is it SAFE? does this happen often or is it just me when they give massive doses of antipsychoitc?

[Guest]

The higher the dosage, the greater amount and sometimes different type of transmitters the drug hits. The max recommended dosages are generally more of a guide than an absolute.

You seem to love making posts like this, heh.

[koali777]

Perhaps they have the mentality that "more is better"? lol. Thankfully, I only had one pdoc that did that to me. Some of those dosages are crazy, like the 320 mg of Geodon or the 50 mg of Zyprexa. Don't think they'll kill you, though. When I was on higher than the max dose of Geodon I wasn't being physically hurt...just super flat. It's possible too that pdocs don't want to put you through trying to change ANOTHER med so they just up the dosage on the one you're on. Generally I think they care about your wellbeing but yeah, there are some that keep pumping you with drugs for no reason...

[crywolf2010]

Are you still symptomatic at the lower doses?

yes but even at higher doses i am still symptomatic. i dont know what the doctor is trying to do. even i know you cant cure schizophrenia and im not even a doctor.going higher and higher wont cure it?

[bpladybug]

Cry wolf, do they ever add something as an adjuct ti help ??? Suchas lithium?? I am on my phone and can't see your sig

[SashaSue]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something.

ETA:

Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

[hammock]

Higher doses are antipsychotic and lower doses are not. You can't cure sz but you sure can treat it and make life better.

[Velvet Elvis]

FWIW you won't get brain damage by going beyond the max recommended dose.

[bpladybug]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something. ETA: Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

I thought low dose lithium was used as an adjunct to other meds, such as ADs. Even when the patient is not bipolar. Just a thought. Maybe it is never used for pure schizophrenia, just SZA. AP's are best augmented by other ap's? edit: I found an abstract about using lith as an adjunct for SZ. interesting, but it seems inconclusive

[Velvet Elvis]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something.

ETA:

Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

I thought low dose lithium was used as an adjunct to other meds, such as ADs. Even when the patient is not bipolar.

Just a thought. Maybe it is never used for pure schizophrenia, just SZA.

AP's are best augmented by other ap's? hm Not a higher risk for TD ? hm

edit: I found an abstract about using lith as an adjunct for SZ. interesting, but it seems inconclusive

No.

It was trendy for a while to give lithium as an adjunct to ADs in severe depression cases but in the long term it looks like it didn't really work. Unless there is suspected schitzoaffective disorder there is no reason to combine lithium with an AP for psychosis. You are not a medical professional. Please don't make medical claims you can't substantiate by referring to a study in a peer reviewed medical journal. It's what's asked of our moderators here because we all acknowledge we are not medical professionals. If you're going to venture out on the level of making medical claims we ask that you do the same.

Back it up with hard research or it's bullshit.

[SashaSue]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something.

ETA:

Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

I thought low dose lithium was used as an adjunct to other meds, such as ADs. Even when the patient is not bipolar.

Just a thought. Maybe it is never used for pure schizophrenia, just SZA.

AP's are best augmented by other ap's? hm Not a higher risk for TD ? hm

edit: I found an abstract about using lith as an adjunct for SZ. interesting, but it seems inconclusive

Low dose lithium is used as an adjunct to AD's, for the treatment of depression. It was briefly used as an adjunct in schizophrenia, but studies seem to have found that, in the absence of affective symptoms, there was no benefit from its use.

Using multiple AP's probably does create a higher risk for TD. But, if someone's not able to be functional on one AP, she doesn't really have a lot of other options, so it's not so hard to see how she and her doctor would decide the benefits of adding a second AP would outweigh the risks.

[SashaSue]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something.

ETA:

Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

I thought low dose lithium was used as an adjunct to other meds, such as ADs. Even when the patient is not bipolar.

Just a thought. Maybe it is never used for pure schizophrenia, just SZA.

AP's are best augmented by other ap's? hm Not a higher risk for TD ? hm

edit: I found an abstract about using lith as an adjunct for SZ. interesting, but it seems inconclusive

No.

It was trendy for a while to give lithium as an adjunct to ADs in severe depression cases but in the long term it looks like it didn't really work. Unless there is suspected schitzoaffective disorder there is no reason to combine lithium with an AP for psychosis. You are not a medical professional. Please don't make medical claims you can't substantiate by referring to a study in a peer reviewed medical journal. It's what's asked of our moderators here because we all acknowledge we are not medical professionals. If you're going to venture out on the level of making medical claims we ask that you do the same.

Back it up with hard research or it's bullshit.

I'm confused here. Looking through studies evaluating the use of lithium augmentation in the treatment of depression from the last 5 years-ish, they all seem to support its use, though to differing extents.

I can't tell if the request to not make medical claims one can't substantiate is directed at me, or at bpladybug, but I'm not actually seeing where either one of us did so.

[Velvet Elvis]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something.

ETA:

Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

I thought low dose lithium was used as an adjunct to other meds, such as ADs. Even when the patient is not bipolar.

Just a thought. Maybe it is never used for pure schizophrenia, just SZA.

AP's are best augmented by other ap's? hm Not a higher risk for TD ? hm

edit: I found an abstract about using lith as an adjunct for SZ. interesting, but it seems inconclusive

No.

It was trendy for a while to give lithium as an adjunct to ADs in severe depression cases but in the long term it looks like it didn't really work. Unless there is suspected schitzoaffective disorder there is no reason to combine lithium with an AP for psychosis. You are not a medical professional. Please don't make medical claims you can't substantiate by referring to a study in a peer reviewed medical journal. It's what's asked of our moderators here because we all acknowledge we are not medical professionals. If you're going to venture out on the level of making medical claims we ask that you do the same.

Back it up with hard research or it's bullshit.

I'm confused here. Looking through studies evaluating the use of lithium augmentation in the treatment of depression from the last 5 years-ish, they all seem to support its use, though to differing extents.

I can't tell if the request to not make medical claims one can't substantiate is directed at me, or at bpladybug, but I'm not actually seeing where either one of us did so.

I was speaking to bpladybug and the claim that lithium supplementation to APs has any effect in the treatment of schizophrenia. Past studies may have supported its use in conjunction with an AD for MDD but the current consensus is that evidence supporting such treatment is inconclusive.

[SashaSue]

I don't think lithium is really used much in the treatment of schizophrenia. I can't actually think of what would make sense, to augment AP's, but there must be something.

ETA:

Apparently, AP's are best augmented with other AP's.

I thought low dose lithium was used as an adjunct to other meds, such as ADs. Even when the patient is not bipolar.

Just a thought. Maybe it is never used for pure schizophrenia, just SZA.

AP's are best augmented by other ap's? hm Not a higher risk for TD ? hm

edit: I found an abstract about using lith as an adjunct for SZ. interesting, but it seems inconclusive

No.

It was trendy for a while to give lithium as an adjunct to ADs in severe depression cases but in the long term it looks like it didn't really work. Unless there is suspected schitzoaffective disorder there is no reason to combine lithium with an AP for psychosis. You are not a medical professional. Please don't make medical claims you can't substantiate by referring to a study in a peer reviewed medical journal. It's what's asked of our moderators here because we all acknowledge we are not medical professionals. If you're going to venture out on the level of making medical claims we ask that you do the same.

Back it up with hard research or it's bullshit.

I'm confused here. Looking through studies evaluating the use of lithium augmentation in the treatment of depression from the last 5 years-ish, they all seem to support its use, though to differing extents.

I can't tell if the request to not make medical claims one can't substantiate is directed at me, or at bpladybug, but I'm not actually seeing where either one of us did so.

I was speaking to bpladybug and the claim that lithium supplementation to APs has any effect in the treatment of schizophrenia. Past studies may have supported its use in conjunction with an AD for MDD but the current consensus is that evidence supporting such treatment is inconclusive.

Can you back that up with research please? Because that is absolutely not what I found earlier today.

Also, bpladybug didn't make the claim that lithium supplementation to AP's had any effect. She asked if AP's were ever augmented with anything, like maybe lithium. I just don't think that's making a medical claim. Claims don't generally end in question marks.