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I'm still not sure what I think of this, aside from the fact that I don't live in Wisconsin, I don't vote in Wisconsin, and therefore I have no control over it.

But come on, did anyone really think that "let's leave the state" tactic would actually work?

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Perhaps. But does that allow the Senate Republicans to break the law to get its way?

Did they break the law? I'm not seeing anything suggesting that they broke the law. They just took the union rights thing out of the budget bill (which requires a quorum) and passed it as a regular bill (which does not). Mind you, it hasn't even hit the state Assembly's floor, according to the link you posted. Meaning, it's not a law.

Did you see Naomi Klein on Rachel Maddow last night?

Maddow is right up there with O'Reilly as one of the biggest reasons why the political system in this country is so fucked up. So no, I did not watch Maddow, and I will not watch Maddow. Or anything else on television news stations.

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ack! they were able to get it to a vote.

i am ashamed to admit that i used to live in wisconsin. madison is but a small island of reason (imho) in a sea of republican conservatism.

i was shocked when friends phoned and told me what was going on. "lilly, they're rioting in madison!" (well, it wasn't really a riot, it was a protest) i have admittedly only read madison news sources which are rather liberal, but what really got me was that the unions were willing to negotiate on pension and health insurance payments to maintain collective bargaining rights and walker said no way.

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Well that explains that, then.

Rather than repeat myself, I'll just link to this post I made a while back blasting the American political system in general, and the media machines in particular, for getting involved in tribal warfare and forgetting the point of representative democracy.

As for the Wisconsin labor bill, there's nothing illegal about it as far as I know. It was a simple case of procedural maneuver-countermaneuver - and procedural maneuvering happens in legislatures all over the world on a daily basis. But I will grant that this particular countermaneuver was incredibly ill-advised. It's probably going to come back and bite a lot of Wisconsin legislators in the ass.

As for me? Well, I can't do a damn thing about it, so why should I get so worked up? I have too much of my own shit to worry about.

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exactly Aurochs!!!

It was watching Maddow a few weeks ago that sent me into a political tailspin. and now Im, again, not allowed to pay attention to politics.

I have to worry about my kid & myself. That's enough concern right now.

plus the fact that im super envious of Maddow....but thats a different thread.

db

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Well that explains that, then.

Rather than repeat myself, I'll just link to this post I made a while back blasting the American political system in general, and the media machines in particular, for getting involved in tribal warfare and forgetting the point of representative democracy.

As for the Wisconsin labor bill, there's nothing illegal about it as far as I know. It was a simple case of procedural maneuver-countermaneuver - and procedural maneuvering happens in legislatures all over the world on a daily basis. But I will grant that this particular countermaneuver was incredibly ill-advised. It's probably going to come back and bite a lot of Wisconsin legislators in the ass.

As for me? Well, I can't do a damn thing about it, so why should I get so worked up? I have too much of my own shit to worry about.

Open meeting law is a big deal. It means you have to notice a meeting in advance. That was violated. This goes to court. It will probably go to the US Supreme Court for a few reasons.

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Open meeting law is a big deal. It means you have to notice a meeting in advance. That was violated. This goes to court. It will probably go to the US Supreme Court for a few reasons.

What Federal law was violated that the Supreme Court would get involved?

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Busting unions in one state threatens to start a domino effect in all others and in the Fed gov. This will be challenged by your best attorneys in the country and probably taken as high as it can go. If a case can be made for separation of powers and an impartial, non-political bureaucracy, this will go to the Supreme Court. There are some hallmark laws that touch on this. Sorry. Broken memory due to added Lithium. Can't put names on them right now. Will later if recall gets better.

ETA:

The whole civil service system was in response to the Jacksonian era of corruption. There is fundamental case law on this, particularly at the Federal level. Unions are an outgrowth of that - protection from the politicians. The only question is how it applies to WI.

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You're speaking in very broad generalities. I'm not aware of any specific law forbidding the manner in which the bill was passed, and the Wisconsin Senate majority leader seems confident that it was completely legal. (That doesn't mean that it IS legal, just that it's probably not as cut and dried as you make it out to be.) I'm also unaware of anything in the Wisconsin state constitution or Federal law forbidding the content of the bill. Finally, I have not heard that any lawsuits have been filed or that anyone is preparing to file one.

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I think the Wis. governor has cut off his nose to spite his face in driving his crusade against the union. He has just gone too far beyond any reasonable level of civility.

On the other side, I think the Dem. legislators have done even worse by refusing to perform their constitutional duties. They may not like what is going on in the capitol, but they are obligated to at least show up for work and sit in their seats!!! From that point they can abstain from voting or vote 'no'. Their no-show behavior deserves any punishment that can be legally inflicted including fines, removal from office or prison.

It appears the Republicans have adeptly use the house rules of order to pass the bill. That is common procedure for both sides.

What a mess.

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