Need help sorting this out

[faith]

Nevermind. No help for me anyway.

[gretl]

Nevermind. No help for me anyway.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

HEY!!!  I read your post yesterday; just didn't have time to give it the attention it deserved.  Mostly because I was stuck on the breastfeeding thing ... that would be a really hard decision for me too.  To the point where it would probably trigger a deep depression to give it up!  Talk about a paradox.  C'mon back and let's talk, k?  Pretty please?!

[faith]

It doesn't make much of a difference now. I'm headed for a breakdown (again) if I don't start something. So I started the Lamictal yesterday. I contacted La Leche League and there really isn't a safe mood stabilizer for breastfeeding. I couldn't even make it a month without meds before I became a total wreck. I am trying to resign myself to bottle-feeding. The bizarre thing is, I have 2 kids already, and I don't know how to give a baby a bottle. Isn't that weird? But basically LLLI advises going without medication or just on an anti-depressant. I've been on that "anti-depressant" only road before and it landed me in the psych ward. I just can't do it.

I feel so sad about it, too. I keep remembering sweet milky baby breath. (sigh) But my kids need me to be sane, atleast a LITTLE bit, and I'm not sure I can go through what I did the first two times AGAIN...postpartum depression coupled with bouts of total "what the heck is going on here" mania, complete with hallucinations. Didn't seem so bad at the time because I thought it was normal new mother stuff. But now that I've tasted stability...it's hard to let that go on purpose.

So that's what my sulky post is all about. Don't worry I'm not taking my ball and going home and stuffing it full of straight pins  . I'm taking the pills like a good girl and I have a pdoc appointment in...less than 2 weeks now, if I'm not mistaken. I'm disappointed but life is full of it, ya know?

Thanks for your concern though. I knew this particular "folder" didn't get a lot of traffic, that's not what I was upset about.

[ConfusedCat]

I don't know what I missed, but I just wanted to say I wish you all the best and I couldn't agree more that a stable Mommy is a much better Mommy!

I feel for you and what you will miss with the closeness of breastfeeding, but millions of babies grew/grow up on the bottle and seem none the worse for it.

I had one of each, a wonderful nursing experience with my first, and a bottle (because he would never latch on through weeks of trying) with the second. I even thought I should do the next best thing and pump for his bottles. I guess because he never did nurse I just didn't ever get to a "let-down" phase. Finally after a month I wondered what the hell I was doing all this self tormenting for!

I think we Moms guilt ourselves enough for ten people.

I would rather FEEL the joy and ward off PPD than let myself be convinced my self sacrifice of sanity was worth where the baby sucks sustenance from. They don't care as long as they are nourished and loved.

CC~

My view from the Mommy files.

[gretl]

Oh good.  Well, not "good" good, but good  Not that it's UP to me, but I think you have every right to be upset.

I'm glad you started the Lamictal (FWIW I'm on day 6 or 7 now myself, switching from Trileptal).  Yep, a sane mom is the most important thing of all - just remember that and keep telling yourself that, even after you get stable again.

I don't know how to do the bottle thing either - I'd have to ask my husband, who fed our oldest expressed breastmilk for a few months during the day while he was in grad school.  But that whole mixing formula thing is totally foreign ... I'd have to ask someone else.  Basically I'm lazy and it sounds like a lot of work 

Interesting what you got back from LLL.  Have you read through all of these entries on Dr. Hale's website?  For some reason I would have thought LLL would be using his data.  Although he seems to judge the safety of a med mostly by watching the infant's health (says Lamictal and other AC's are probably OK) ... there's no discussion of possible longer term issues.  I'm not totally sure I'm comfortable with that.  Hmmmm.  I dunno what I'd do if it was me (most of my crazy meds experience came since my second was 8 months old -- then for the first year or so, it was AD's only.  She was a late weaner, but I was comfortable with the amount of meds she was getting as she got older and drinking less milk, and as her metabolism matured.) Sending you kind thoughts as you struggle through this emotional issue ...

[ncc1701]

Heya

Not as an MD, and I've never been a mom. 

But as a woman who was a med student and did a rotation in breastfeeding clinic.

LLL and breastfeeding consultants, as I could see, were completely obsessed with breastfeeding and guilted moms like crazy.

Like others have suggested: look to other sources.  Lamictal has the least bad safety profile, even during pregnancy, and most anti-convulsants are as far as we know safe in breastfeeding.

Plus, babies and moms and dads do just fine with bottles, even if they're full of formula instead of mom's milk.

Do what's right for you.  Remember that babies need moms who are okay, too.  Breast milk is a small part of that.  You need to feel okay.

--ncc--

[faith]

Ahhh, the guilt, the guilt! Yes there is the guilt. I already see it coming. My first two were so healthy as little babies, apart from some preemie jaundice in one! If this one so much as sniffles, I know I'm going to be beating my head against the wall (er, figuratively) about it. That vaunted immunity, you know. I am a Modern Mother, Therefore I have been Brainwashed lol

I actually did read the Dr. Hale posts. I definitely have reservations because of the whole "long term effects" issue. They're finding out now that mothers who took Depakote while pregnant, even if their babies escaped the heightened risk of birth defects, the babies end up having more developmental delays and lower IQs a few years down the road than the placebo moms' kidlets. Heck I could find a study to prove probably anything, but that scared me. We just don't know. Even with the Lamictal, it might be the safest we know of right now, but there isn't that much hard data yet. I want to be put on the registry for it. [standing on soapbox] I think every mom who has to take this stuff should be put on registries so we can get some of that data. If you have to take it anyway, why not help out other moms, too?  [soapbox collapses] Just my two cents' worth.

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I know I probably care a little too much about the breastfeeding thing. It was just such a special experience, even in the midst of my craziness. I know it's not the be-all and end-all, but it's all I know.

[StrungOutOnLife]

I think every mom who has to take this stuff should be put on registries so we can get some of that data. If you have to take it anyway, why not help out other moms, too?

[chinacat]

LLL is known to be anti-most every type of medication while nursing.  They are very conservative, some would call them REALLY off the map  right wing when it comes to BFeeding.  I mean, to LLL if you don't B'feed, you might as well be poisoning your child.  There are women who cannot or who choose not to B'feed--and its OK.  As you say, sane momas do better! And we live in a world of choice, thank the goddess for that!

But please--do NOT take the LLL's view on any drug during Bfeeding as absoolute gospel, because they are the Tom Cruise's of Breast feeding when it comes to meds, if you get my drift.

There are so many other good sources, many listed here--

You're not alone, and you can do this.  We're here if you need us, any time!

blessings, china (rumors of my demise are quite exadurated--I merely moved, got very sick physically and lost my computer---but I'm baack!)

[faith]

lol Thanks China. Glad to see you back!

Yes I would describe LLL as slightly militant about the whole breastfeeding thing. Frankly I'm kind of scared that I'll get attacked by one of the on-staff lactation consultants when I give birth if I end up bottle-feeding right off the bat (which I suspect I will have to. Lamictal as monotherapy is thus far not doing anything but making me eat and sleep and ramping up my agitation level a few notches.)

<begin off topic rant> Argh I'm about dying here! I've had a couple of really bad days right in a row. I can't believe I've managed to get worse in just a couple of years! I wonder if I can sue the idiot pdoc who kept me on high doses of SSRIs for years for triggering some kind of bipolar brain meltdown. My baby's goin' to college! lol <end off topic rant>

[yogamomma]

Faith- I completely understand your concerns and dilema.  Feel free to write to me whenever.  I've been through that decision before... well not totally.  I was not diagnosed w/ BP until after my daughter was born- so the meds during pg question was not applicable.

I'm a breastfeeding mom- I can't imagine not breastfeeding- just the way it is for me.  I won't put my health or my baby's health in jeopardy just to nurse, but I can't just accept the "don't nurse while taking X medication" w/o backup. 

My husband is training to be a doctor...so I know first hand that doctors do NOT know much at ALL about breastfeeding (everything he learned, he learned from me and our children).  Pediatricians, Psychiatrists, Family doctors, and OBs...they really don't know much about nursing.  They know even less about meds while nursing.  Sure, there are a few studies here and there with random drugs, but it's hard to sort through it all.  Dr. Hale studies this stuff- I trust his book.  I trust breastfeeding friendly Sites that urge you to try other alternatives before stopping nursing- ones that tell you most drugs probably are OK.

I know I have no personal info on long term s/e info, but in the past year, I've taken quite a few mood stabilizers and AP's while nursing my daughter (on demand).  There was only one occassion where I pumped/dumped after taking a med.  That was the first time I took Zyprexa- I was taking Zyprexa and Depakote at the same time and sleeping constantly (I needed it).  My daughter was only 3 months old.  I wasn't comfortable taking Z because I couldn't find much info.  So, I would nurse her, take the med and then pump/dump about 6 hrs later (I couldn't wake up any sooner!) while my husband bottlefed.  I did take Zyprexa again when my daughter was older and I did not adjust my feeding schedule at all.

- so where was I going with this?  Oh yeah, I have not noticed any harmful s/e or problems with my daughter while taking Depakote, Lamictal, Zyprexa, Risperdal, Tegretol, or Zoloft (with my first daughter for what it's worth!).  Oh and I'm at the max doses of Lamictal and Depakote right now.  I have a very supportive pdoc who is willing to work with me to find meds I'm comfortable with while nursing.  That helps.  I also get blood tests to check my serum levels and my daughter has been tested too (poor baby).  I've had my milk tested... everything checks out ok.

Just wanted to throw in my 2 cents and support.  It's nice to see some other mothers on this board!