Lamictal and fatigue

[nova2012]

Hi all,

First post here.

I've been taking Lamictal 200mg (100mg morning and 100mg night) for about four months now and Wellbutrin XL 300mg for about eight for depressive disorder NOS (maybe "subthreshold" bipolar as it's depression with atypical features and there is cyclicality involved).

I stopped Wellbutrin cold turkey a week and a half ago, which may very well be causing or contributing to the fatigue I'm experiencing. I don't think it was usually this bad while taking both meds (except for maybe a day out of each week, when I seemed to have "energy"/cognition/slight mood dips). Since Wellbutrin is known to be activating, this would probably make sense.

In any event, my reason for d/c'ing WB is because I want to try this supplement called EmpowerPlus. It has tons of amino acids and vitamins. Not sure if anyone here has heard of it--I suspect yes--but it's reportedly got an 85% success rate in treating bipolar, depression, schizophrenia, and a host of other psychiatric disorders. Yes, I'm *highly* skeptical too, but I'm sick of the side effects and potential problems down the line of continuing with these crazymeds. (That reminds me--has anyone here had experience with Empowerplus, good or bad?) So I'm going out on a limb and trying it, crossing my fingers till they're almost broken the whole way. Heh.

So ultimately, in the next month or so, I'm probably going to taper off Lamictal. My main question is, has anyone experienced debilitating fatigue while on Lamictal, particularly in the afternoon? I feel this wave of exhaustion and drowsiness hit me at about 2-3pm every single day, to the point where I can barely concentrate and just want to sleep. I also have a *tremendous* hell of a time getting up in the mornings. Just want to sleep all day. Obviously this is not good or normal, nor is it conducive to working or being an otherwise functional member of society.

I'm thinking one of two things: this could be a direct result of the Lamictal, or it could be a low-level constant dysthymia with atypical features (feeling tired, wanting to sleep a lot, etc.) breaking through, perhaps having worsened since d/c'ing Wellbutrin and losing those stimulating effects (or maybe even a withdrawal symptom/rebound depression from stopping WB).

I just don't know what to do at this point. My mood isn't great, but it's bearable most of the time. However, the most debilitating aspect of my depression...or med side effects...is the constant fatigue and cognitive slowness/dysfunction. My memory has improved since d/c'ing Wellbutrin, I think, and I believe I'm actually a little less paranoid too (got pretty hypervigilant on WB...even more so than usual, heh).

Anyone have any insight/ideas? BTW, my diagnoses (most professionally confirmed) are DD-NOS, ADHD Combined, social phobia, OCD, some personality issues, maybe GAD.

[tryp]

Oh yes. I was EXHAUSTED when I got up to my target dose of Lamictal. I was sleeping 12+ hours a night, and by around 1 pm, I was ready for a 4 hour nap. I could barely leave the house and walk two blocks without feeling like I was going to pass out. It did go away with time though. In your case, though, if this is new for you, I'd be inclined to put the finger at least partly on possible recurrent symptoms from stopping Wellbutrin, since it's always easiest to blame a new problem on the most recent change you made.

Are you consulting your doctor on these changes? It can be VERY dangerous to stop medications on your own, especially if you cold-turkey, as you say you did with Wellbutrin. And your doctor can also advise you on this EmpowerPlus stuff.

It's your body and it's your choice, but frankly, I'd take prescription medication which has been extensively studied and subjected to analysis and quality control over some over-the-counter substance that comes from God-knows-where and contains God-knows-what. I know a lot of people who have stopped their meds and honestly, it doesn't usually end well. The jury is out on long term effects - there are people here who have been on their meds for years with no ill effects. And the long term effects of poorly controlled illness can seriously do you an injury.

[tryp]

About EmpowerPlus - I don't know where you are, but I'm in Canada, and Health Canada is NOT fond of this stuff: http://www.canada.com/topics/bodyandhealth/story.html?id=bd251482-14ae-46a2-9812-41c6d564f4da

Just because something is natural doesn't mean it won't harm you. Megadoses of vitamins and natural substances can have side effects and cause harm just as pharmaceuticals can.

[notfred]

Truehope's Em Power is a multivitiman/mineral + amino acid pill. The ingredients are here: https://www.mytruehope.net/store/_documents/EMP_Capsules_Facts_Sheet.pdf

If vitamins had a 85% success rate in remitting MI we would not be here bitching about our meds ? Mental Illness, with the exception of specific cases, is not a vitamin deficiency.

I think it is foolish to stop your meds to try an overpriced multivitamin pill.

nf

[AirMarshall]

Ah, TruHope Empower Whatever....

Yes we re-visit an old fraud. LOL. It's been several years since we talked about them.

They change their name, ingredients and marketing like a tree changes its leaves. In just the 8 years I have been watching them it is amazing to see their development.

-Looks like the most recent and significant change is that they no longer contain Lithium Orotate. Which is good as that significantly improves the safety of the product, but likewise pulls a major leg from their previous claim to treat Bipolar Disorder. Did you know they were started out by a Canadian pig farmer who gave some of the minerals to his Bipolar daughter and "cured" her?

I hope you are coordinating all your meds and supplements with your psychiatrist and all your doctors. Remember with supplements, "All things in moderation".

best, a.m.

Last I knew they were charging $20 a bottle. If you take their ingredient list to the grocery store vitamin section you can probably save a ton of money. A good daily vitamin with minerals is all most people need.

[San]

My experience with Truehope, being bipolar, etc. I had the book about the bipolar girl who was cured. That's why I tried it.

Insomnia. Horrible insomnia. They claim it causes this. I was severely allergic to something in it and landed in the ER a few times dehydrated from vomiting. They aren't doctors telling you how to taper off your meds, either, just people that work for them. I suppose I was in the 15% that doesn't respond. My moods swung. I was chugging Inositol..

[SashaSue]

Tru Hope empower plus is completely, utterly, useless. Don't waste your time, or risk your stability.

Even if you want to try it, why would you go off of your meds first? That just doesn't even make sense.

Ah, TruHope Empower Whatever....

Yes we re-visit an old fraud. LOL. It's been several years since we talked about them.

They change their name, ingredients and marketing like a tree changes its leaves. In just the 8 years I have been watching them it is amazing to see their development.

-Looks like the most recent and significant change is that they no longer contain Lithium Orotate. Which is good as that significantly improves the safety of the product, but likewise pulls a major leg from their previous claim to treat Bipolar Disorder. Did you know they were started out by a Canadian pig farmer who gave some of the minerals to his Bipolar daughter and "cured" her?

I hope you are coordinating all your meds and supplements with your psychiatrist and all your doctors. Remember with supplements, "All things in moderation".

best, a.m.

Last I knew they were charging $20 a bottle. If you take their ingredient list to the grocery store vitamin section you can probably save a ton of money. A good daily vitamin with minerals is all most people need.

I don't believe they make their ingredient list publicly available.

[tryp]

This is the ingredient list per their website: https://www.mytruehope.net/store/_documents/EMP_Capsules_Facts_Sheet.pdf

[Catnapper]

I've been taking Lamictal 200mg (100mg morning and 100mg night) for about four months now and Wellbutrin XL 300mg for about eight for depressive disorder NOS (maybe "subthreshold" bipolar as it's depression with atypical features and there is cyclicality involved).

I stopped Wellbutrin cold turkey a week and a half ago, which may very well be causing or contributing to the fatigue I'm experiencing. I don't think it was usually this bad while taking both meds (except for maybe a day out of each week, when I seemed to have "energy"/cognition/slight mood dips). Since Wellbutrin is known to be activating, this would probably make sense.

First, welcome to the boards. Second, don't be surprised if it seems you are not getting warm fuzzy responses to quitting meds in favor of supplements, as this is a pro-med crowd for the most part.

I'm sorry that you don't feel the meds are working, and that you're worried about long term effects. I think that your excessive fatigue is definitely due to suddenly stopping Wellbutrin, and possibly as a side effect of Lamictal. I started Lamictal on a split am/pm dose, but switched to an all bedtime dose as it made me tired. My pdoc (psychiatrist) says that about 20% of his patients find it sedating.

In any event, my reason for d/c'ing WB is because I want to try this supplement called EmpowerPlus. It has tons of amino acids and vitamins. Not sure if anyone here has heard of it--I suspect yes--but it's reportedly got an 85% success rate in treating bipolar, depression, schizophrenia, and a host of other psychiatric disorders. .

I'm not sure why you would want to stop WB so you could start a supplement? No supplements are an effective treatment for any type of MI (mental illness), although many of us take supplements as an add-on to treatment with meds. Fish oil especially has shown to help with depression, but not enough to eliminate meds.

Yes, I'm *highly* skeptical too, but I'm sick of the side effects and potential problems down the line of continuing with these crazymeds. .

If you're having problems with side effects you need to talk to your doctor, and I can't believe your doctor advised you to stop WB cold-turkey and replace it with vitamins. Also, I'm not sure what 'potential problems down the line' you're referring to. I've been taking WB for 12 years with no negative effects, and Lamictal for two, also with no negative effect, other than working out the initial drowsiness and changing the dosing schedule. I get bloodwork done annually as part of my physical, and my liver panel always comes back normal. If you have other information on long-term use and detrimental effects I'd be interested in reading it.

If you have a serious mood disorder like MDD or any type of bipolar, especially if you have had multiple episodes (you mentioned cycles), I'm sorry to tell you that you have a chronic disease that is not going to go away, but can go into full remission with the right treatment. Supplements are not the right treatment.

I have to run so can't quote and respond to the rest of your post, but I think you're making some really bad decisions regarding your health. Do some reading here and I think you will see that discontinuing meds altogether is generally a really bad idea. There are lots of meds to try, and it may take some time to find a combo that works well and has a low side effect profile for you, but it's worth the time and effort. I have spent a lot of time in the abyss and I love my meds, because they have allowed me to get my old self back and not live my life in a depressive haze. Good luck to you.