Jump to content
CrazyBoards.org

Recommended Posts

I've lived half my life online since I was 12 or so and I have a few people I've been friends with for over ten years and we know more about each other than any of our rl friends do. That's why I reacted so strongly to this. No I'm not going to share those conversations with my gf. They are none of her goddamn business and she knows and respects that. For her to sit in on the conversations would be a huge breach of privacy so no, I'm not comfortable with her doing so. Friendships can be just as important and exclusive as romantic relationships. You love the people just as strongly, albeit differently.

I agree that friendships can be just as important as romatic relationships. Absolutely. But exclusive? That doesn't even make sense. I think there's a huge difference between having biundaries your partner respects, and having areas of your life you wouldn't discuss with her no matter how much your silence might bother her. Information sharing is part of intimacy. Distribution of information implies differential levels of intimacy. If you'd be willing to cause your gf endless pain, or even lose the relationship, rather than divulge details of your relationships with other women, something's not right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think every person has boundaries about what behavior is okay in a relationship from their partner. Everyone is different, and part of choosing a partner is choosing someone with a compatible lifestyle and set of boundaries. For some couples, that may mean not having intimate friends of the opposite gender. For others, each member may have a lot of friends of the opposite gender. Sexual flirting may be okay in some relationships and not in others. It's just different for everyone. I'm not judging anyone.

However, couples have to agree to live by each others' boundaries honestly and fully. They need to craft their relationship so that both parties feel safe. If not, mistrust steps in, and that is the downfall of a relationship. In this case, I wouldn't be marrying this guy anytime soon, not because he's necessarily doing anything wrong, but because neither would be happy, it seems, living by the other's rules.

I spent years in a relationship with a man who thought I was cheating on him all the time, even with my GAY male friends who had no interest in women at all. He never trusted me, period. Without trust, there was no intimacy, really. Which made me seek out friendships and closeness elsewhere and reinforced the whole fucking mess. I see a lot of women who freak out that their SO's like pornography. I like porn and don't mind if my SO does too. I don't get it, but I do get that if someone chooses to get into a relationship with someone who doesn't like their SO watching porn, then they should stop watching porn for the sake of the relationship.

Point is, every person/couple is different. It's not up to us to judge, really, except to say that where there's no trust there's no relationship. That's easy enough.

Would the same thing apply to a guy who isolated a woman, wouldn't let her have friends, etc? Usually we tell those people to get the hell out even if it means going to a shelter. I think there's a huge double standard here.

Where are you getting the idea the OP is isolating her bf? Or that she, or anyone else who's posted here, is checking fb or email behind their SO's back? Or, as you said in an earlier post, that these relationships are neither sexual nor romantic? Relationships can be sexual without ever becoming physical. They can be deeply romantic without ever becoming explicitly sexual. And none of the women posting described the problematic relationships as neither sexual nor romantic. Whatever exactly it is you are replying to here, it doesn't really seem to be anywhere in this thread.

It looks like a post has been deleted from the thread.

This in and of itself is pretty fucked up though:

One of the affairs was a secret "friendship" with a woman he met through his work. I found emails between them that had been going on for at least 6 months during our relationship. There was nothing sexual in the emails. She had asked to friend him on Facebook, but he replied telling her that he didn't want me to know about her and could they just exchange emails?

The second was a woman SO works with. He exchanged email, home phone numbers and FB friendships with her before he told me she even existed. Then she started calling him at all hours and he'd drop everything (including plans with me) to listen to her whining about all of her "crises" in life. He admitted that they "confide in each other." Now she has a bf of her own and doesn't call SO anymore, but my back still goes up a bit when I hear they've been chatting at work.

If I'm talking to someone online who's in crisis, damn right I'm going to bow out of going to K-Mart with the gf to get new laundry baskets.

I have many friends of the opposite gender in whom I confide on a regular basis.

If I had to live with someone with this kind of paranoid outlook, damn right I'd keep my friendships with members of the opposite sex secret.

The bottom line is that if your SO thinks they have the right to pick and chose who you're friends with, your relationship is fucked up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, there are such varied opinions on the subject. I think it all comes down to the definition of "SO".

A casual SO is very different from a life partner. I'm married, and my relationship with my husband is my top priority. None of my friends - male or female, no longer how long I've known them - usurp him in my priority list, and vice versa. Our closest relationship is with each other, and this is as it should be.

With that kind of relationship come boundaries and limits. If another relationship - male or female - starts taking precedence over the one with the life partner, then something is wrong with the life partner relationship. The neglected partner has a right to get upset about it because commitments are being broken.

If DH and I were only in a casual relationship with few, if any, commitments, it would be a different story. If we did have a casual relationship, and other relationships took priority over the SO relationship, then the SO relationship really wouldn't be going anywhere then. If one of the partners got upset, it would be because they wanted more from the relationship than the other wanted to give. I think it would be best to end such a relationship, because neither person would be happy in it in that situation.

I've had boyfriends (pre-marriage) that did get upset over some of my friendships, and because I didn't like that they did that, it was clear to me that me and said boyfriend would never be my life partner. But with DH, I did want to put him first over all others, and that made all the difference.

Edited by Odetta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've lived half my life online since I was 12 or so and I have a few people I've been friends with for over ten years and we know more about each other than any of our rl friends do. That's why I reacted so strongly to this. No I'm not going to share those conversations with my gf. They are none of her goddamn business and she knows and respects that. For her to sit in on the conversations would be a huge breach of privacy so no, I'm not comfortable with her doing so. Friendships can be just as important and exclusive as romantic relationships. You love the people just as strongly, albeit differently.

I agree that friendships can be just as important as romatic relationships. Absolutely. But exclusive? That doesn't even make sense. I think there's a huge difference between having biundaries your partner respects, and having areas of your life you wouldn't discuss with her no matter how much your silence might bother her. Information sharing is part of intimacy. Distribution of information implies differential levels of intimacy. If you'd be willing to cause your gf endless pain, or even lose the relationship, rather than divulge details of your relationships with other women, something's not right.

Responding again now that you edited your post. . .

It might have something to do with my role at CB, but I've made friends with people whose childhood sexual abuse stories I know. I'm not going to tell my gf about that and she doesn't want to know. She'd be pissed off if I told her. A long term romantic relationship does not automatically mean that both people should know everything the other person knows. All close interpersonal relationships have their own character. They are all precious. If sometimes one means keeping a secret then so be it. My gf has no interest in most of my online friendships but respects my right to have them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I found emails between them that had been going on for at least 6 months during our relationship. There was nothing sexual in the emails. She had asked to friend him on Facebook, but he replied telling her that he didn't want me to know about her and could they just exchange emails?

To me, trust is the most important factor in a committed relationship

But I really have my doubts about the long-term viability of any relationship if it isn't based on total, mutual trust.

Ok, who betrayed who here? Going though emails and Facebook... how is that ok? In the end, you didn't find anything. Nothing was going on. Trust goes both ways. I would never consider going into personal files as being alright. It's a huge breach of trust. How are those relationships any worse that what was done to find our about them?

Everyone is different, and part of choosing a partner is choosing someone with a compatible lifestyle and set of boundaries.

However, couples have to agree to live by each others' boundaries honestly and fully. They need to craft their relationship so that both parties feel safe. If not, mistrust steps in, and that is the downfall of a relationship. In this case, I wouldn't be marrying this guy anytime soon, not because he's necessarily doing anything wrong, but because neither would be happy, it seems, living by the other's rules.

Point is, every person/couple is different. It's not up to us to judge, really, except to say that where there's no trust there's no relationship. That's easy enough.

Betraying a partner's trust is a form of abuse as surely as any other type of abuse.

I've lived half my life online since I was 12 or so and I have a few people I've been friends with for over ten years and we know more about each other than any of our rl friends do.

No I'm not going to share those conversations with my gf. They are none of her goddamn business and she knows and respects that.

The second was a woman SO works with. He exchanged email, home phone numbers and FB friendships with her before he told me she even existed. Then she started calling him at all hours and he'd drop everything (including plans with me) to listen to her whining about all of her "crises" in life. He admitted that they "confide in each other." Now she has a bf of her own and doesn't call SO anymore, but my back still goes up a bit when I hear they've been chatting at work.

I agree with muriel. There are rules to every relationship. If you break them.. well that's a legitimate issue. However, if those rules are so strict as to avoid outside friendships - that is controlling and a form of abuse. A person needs outside contacts besides their SO. A healthy relationship will include that.

Personal conversations are private. Privacy still exists within a relationship. Just because you're with someone that doesn't mean that they should have access to other people's private thoughts. You wouldn't pass along what your friend at work told you in confidence. How is online any different? All a SO needs to know is that you talk to people online. End of story.

Also, even more to the point..if you want to talk about trust in a relationship? If a private crisis conversation was passed along... You have to realize that that information was never meant to be shared.. and certainly not approved by the person that wrote it. A betrayal like that... if they could do that to that person, how in the world can you trust them not to do it to you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been cheated on (SO sleeping with another woman) and I've had my privacy violated (SO reading my journals without my knowledge or permission). Both violations in trust ended those relationships.

I've been in a head space where I've pried; in retrospect it was because that guy told me that he had a history of infidelity and I didn't trust him. There was no way that relationship was going to last, I just didn't trust him.

Trust, once violated, in my experience, is nearly impossible to rebuild.

I don't think I would label having important friendships outside of the relationship as cheating. But there's obviously a serious trust issue at hand here that needs to be addressed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know the answer here....are you fine with your fiance having friends who are female usually, only the idea that he didn't want this one to be open to you? Because that is a bit of a red flag right there with that particular friendship, really.

Also, is there more history here that we don't know about w/r/t going through fb accounts and email accounts and whatnot, like, is he naturally overly flirty in real life and such and so? I mean, IDK, it's possible that the two of you don't have compatible boundaries really.

I mean, I'm sure my husband knows that I have male friends on line but we're not exactly discussing the kind of earth shattering revelations that my husband doesn't know about me, nor would I neglect important commitments to him that I've made for online friendships, I don't think.

I think I'd be upset to know my husband were spending hours and hours online with female friends discussing their childhood sexual abuse with them while I was off hard at work for example.... but I know absolutely that he wouldn't be pulling that kind of shit.

That said, helping a female friend through a genuine crisis would supersede going to the grocery store with me, but I'd consider that to be a very rare event, not a common one exactly. And compared to say an anniversary dinner or something? No way, jose. I wouldn't be online or available at that time in any case. I find the off switch to my computer very valuable really. That's one of the things I LIKE about the virtual world.... the ability to switch it off. As needed.

I think you do have some things to sort out in couples counseling anyway, to ensure neither one of you is feeling prisoner to the other and that you are compatible, honestly, before you progress further in any case. Divorce is more expensive than some preemptive couples counseling. Especially once you reach the kid stage. Take it from me.

Anna

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are so many heated opinions! I know that intimacy can be created without it becoming physical. The question is- are both partners o.k with that? Some people are jealous, which I can understand to a certain degree. Stalking facebook and playing headgames- that's going too far- IMO.

I have hard time understanding jealously, as I equate it to control and trust. If one partner is jealous and the other doesn't understand what all the fuss is about, there is no meeting of the minds, no common ground, nothing to build a level of trust that is there- but on different planes, so to speak. I don't know if I explained myself well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Responding again now that you edited your post. . .

It might have something to do with my role at CB, but I've made friends with people whose childhood sexual abuse stories I know. I'm not going to tell my gf about that and she doesn't want to know. She'd be pissed off if I told her. A long term romantic relationship does not automatically mean that both people should know everything the other person knows. All close interpersonal relationships have their own character. They are all precious. If sometimes one means keeping a secret then so be it. My gf has no interest in most of my online friendships but respects my right to have them.

I think you've got the key here.. at least from where I'm sitting. If I understand correctly, your girlfriend knows of the relationships existing, just not the details of the people? There's a huge difference between casually dropping a name or a common thought into a conversation, and breaking the confidence of the friend instead of hiding something from the SO. I could see it being alright in a situation like, 'Oh, thus-and-so told me a joke I think you'll like,' but like your girlfriend I would not want to be told about those confidences.

My boyfriend has many female friends. I'm friends with a few of them as well, others I only know a name, sometimes a general vicinity. Some of those others love to flirt with him, and mutual friends come running to me saying that he's flirting as well. He's a friendly guy, it can be seen as flirting sometimes. There was one instance where a mutual friend was openly flirting with him on twitter, but he's not really able to tell when someone is flirting with him. Privately, I asked if he was aware how she felt, and that it bothered me a little that she clearly thought he was returning the interest. He apologized to me, then apparently sent her a message apologizing if he'd sent the wrong message, that he was devoted to me. End of conflict. I have a couple of male friends that sparked a little jealousy from him at first, until I explained that they're just friends that I rarely see, and that he is the one I am very happily dating. He now passes on hellos, and in one case knows that the only time I hear from one of the guys is when he's having a rough time and needs to vent, so boyfriend asks very generally if the friend is ok, and says he hopes things get better soon.

We love each other madly, boyfriend and I, but we wouldn't be looking forward to a two-year anniversary without trust. Without trust, I'm not even sure it's love, but that's just me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My DH has no clue as to the social norms of flirting. He'll talk to anybody. I had to tell him not to joke around with our neighbor when I saw steam coming from her hubby's ears. My 16 yr old even mentioned that it was not appropriate. It was o.k for me and her, but the husband didn't seem so friendly!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My fiancè and I do go to couples counseling and we have been for like 3-4 months due to VERBALLY cheating. He didn't want to do the couples counseling at first, but now he is all for it. I'm just still having an issue with looking to see if he is bc my heart was broke and I don't want it to get to that point again. Everything is great so far but I jus don't wanna be snooping etc. And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My Hubs and I have been married for 12 years (together for almost 19) and although yes, we do share SS numbers, bank accounts, ect.....I however, do not go through my husband's wallet EVER and I do not go through his facebook account or email account without his permission. He also offers the same level of respect back to me, because, well, that's what it is, a level of respect. That said, I can say without a shadow of a doubt that I know neither of us would really mind if the other did log into each other's accounts for whatever reason, but that's not really the point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My fiancè and I do go to couples counseling and we have been for like 3-4 months due to VERBALLY cheating. He didn't want to do the couples counseling at first, but now he is all for it. I'm just still having an issue with looking to see if he is bc my heart was broke and I don't want it to get to that point again. Everything is great so far but I jus don't wanna be snooping etc. And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

I think that important thing of note here is that "he broke your heart." There are trust issues at play there. Also, you "don't wanna be snooping" shows that you kinda know that you don't trust him and therefore are doing something unhealthy for the marriage out of wishing not to be hurt. I believe that as long as those things online are considered private by both parties - there is no issue with that. But both people have to be on the same page. For that individual - they are; she's ok with it & I'm betting the same goes for him and he doesn't look at her stuff either. That level of trust is a *good* sign in a relationship. I'm not saying it has to be there for it to work - but it's a positive, not a negative. He's not actively *showing* you these things - that's not good. If you need to see them, you need to work that out in the counseling... otherwise he has no reason to trust you either. I still think sharing something private and personal to another person is wrong and indicative of not being a trustworthy person. In these cases.. if it's not ok in the marriage - he should not be showing them to you.. and instead not doing it at all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Vapourware

And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

Wut?

If my partner snooped at my internet forum discussions, emails, FB, etc., I would be very upset. Just because I'm with someone doesn't mean I have to share everything with them. My partner has his sphere of privacy and I have mine. I have my life, he has his. I don't have any inclination to look at his internet communications, either. In fact, I think the fact you think that it's okay to be looking at your partner's private discussions is disturbing.

ETA: If my boyfriend kept invading my privacy - yeah. I wouldn't marry him, period.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My wife never reads my email and I never read hers. If either of us find something we think will be of interest we forward it to the other. We both have facebook, but I don't really know how it works so she has to go on it to help me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest

My fiancè and I do go to couples counseling and we have been for like 3-4 months due to VERBALLY cheating. He didn't want to do the couples counseling at first, but now he is all for it. I'm just still having an issue with looking to see if he is bc my heart was broke and I don't want it to get to that point again. Everything is great so far but I jus don't wanna be snooping etc. And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

He's verbally cheating on you because you expect him to, any man who is constantly accused and checked up on would. You're effectively doing this to yourself, it's ridiculous. Get off the pot or shit, don't spend your life supervising a grown adult you claim to trust.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

Wut?

If my partner snooped at my internet forum discussions, emails, FB, etc., I would be very upset. Just because I'm with someone doesn't mean I have to share everything with them. My partner has his sphere of privacy and I have mine. I have my life, he has his. I don't have any inclination to look at his internet communications, either. In fact, I think the fact you think that it's okay to be looking at your partner's private discussions is disturbing.

ETA: If my boyfriend kept invading my privacy - yeah. I wouldn't marry him, period.

Here, here! I feel the same way, only my relationship dates back to when I was 17, I am almost 43 now, and even after so many years together we have our own avenues online we go, when we meet up IRL between internet outtings there's always trust. I would never dream of looking in his wallet unless he told me to, or to even TOUCH his computer in his lil mancave. Now he's able to go on mine, and so is the kid, 15 year old, he does go on mine, I have a laptop and a desktop out here, but I don't worry, I have nothing to hide. He's never cheated on me, and I don't think you're doing yourself any favors if you can't let go of this implied cheating, I mean there was NO exchange of bodily fluids, THAT my friend, is cheating, straight up.

My fiancè and I do go to couples counseling and we have been for like 3-4 months due to VERBALLY cheating. He didn't want to do the couples counseling at first, but now he is all for it. I'm just still having an issue with looking to see if he is bc my heart was broke and I don't want it to get to that point again. Everything is great so far but I jus don't wanna be snooping etc. And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

He's verbally cheating on you because you expect him to, any man who is constantly accused and checked up on would. You're effectively doing this to yourself, it's ridiculous. Get off the pot or shit, don't spend your life supervising a grown adult you claim to trust.

I am with the others who've posted about this being a problem you either suck up and move on from or don't, so you need to focus and get constructive with your energy, not destructive by snooping or putting up walls that will serve to break down the intimacy you have together. The bit in red is my response to that post of Vapourware's. Best of luck to you Mary. You'll do the right thing. :)

Edited by Bionic Duelist

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest

In fact, for your next relationship, let me give you some advice:

As a smart woman, infidelity is something that isn't in your worldview, it's not on your radar. You have to act like you're not insecure (even if deep down you are). Like other woman aren't prettier than you, you haven't been cheated on before, you don't think about what it would be like if your SO cheated on you, like you don't feel the need to give him warnings, check his messages, question his liaisons with other women, snark at his ex girlfriends etc.

The best way to avoid a man being unfaithful is to make it seem like the very thought is unthinkable because you're so awesome it would never have registered that he might even be unfaithful. You'd never even put the idea in your head that he might be. That's because you're full of self esteem and healthy friendships outside of your relationship. You don't feel in rivalry or conflict, you know that you're good enough, you're not waiting for your relationship to crash and burn because you're not enough of a woman to satisfy him.

Women like this, who don't feel insecure and bitchy all the time, these are women that men want more of.

My SO knows that if he went with another person, I'd cease to want him in my life anyway, and so he toes a very clear line of making me number one. No drama and couples counselling and FB stalking, if he cheated I'd be like 'Next!' and he;d be out on his ear where he belonged. Yeah I'd be hurt, but I don't put up with that sort of stuff.

Women who spend a lot of time worrying about their SO cheating do so because they feel inferior and not good enough. They push all that out onto their SO and badger him constantly about it, they're moody, jealous, angry and unkind. No wonder they get cheated on. When they do get cheated on, they're finally happy because they finally have something to hold over their SO's head for the rest of his life, something to manipulate him with and blame him for. I know because my step mother is just like this, always paranoid that my dad will stray and ready to condemn him. It's not loving someone, it's bullying someone.

Edited by Titania

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My fiancè and I do go to couples counseling and we have been for like 3-4 months due to VERBALLY cheating. He didn't want to do the couples counseling at first, but now he is all for it. I'm just still having an issue with looking to see if he is bc my heart was broke and I don't want it to get to that point again. Everything is great so far but I jus don't wanna be snooping etc. And to the person who thinks its okay and your gf can't look at your stuff bc of privacy, how in the fuck you gonna get married???? You share everything from S.s. numbers to bank accounts and your worried about your lil internet privacy haha please get off this topic cas your sounding rediculious! If my fiancè had said that to me I would def being giving him the word about it!!!

You don't trust him. It's obvious. Marrying him would be a very bad idea. Until you can let go of the past and trust him, you're going to be miserable, and so is he. And he may cope with that misery by seeking out other women since he's done it before. It becomes cyclical.

Married couples don't have to share bank accounts and the like. That's a choice each couple makes.

I don't really care if the BF reads my stuff as long as he was upfront about doing it and why he was doing it. He knows what I do online anyway, so it's not a huge deal. I don't snoop in his stuff either, but if I needed to find something for bills or our schedule or whatever, I don't think it would be a big deal. We just don't have a lot of secrets from one another, but then again, we also allow each other privacy. I trust him, he trusts me. These things become non-issues if there's genuine trust.

Edited by muriel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We share a computer and passwords are generally stored on there. Yes, I suppose I could look through his FB, email, and whatnot. I don't because, to me, that would be a huge violation of trust. He once asked if he could read some of the things on here, particularly my blog entries. I told him I would be very uncomfortable with that. So, he doesn't read on here. It's just like I would never read his texts or his phone log. Nor would I pry into private conversations, particularly with friends who are in a crisis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...