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Feeling crazier than I was before..


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Hey guys,

I guess this is both a question and a vent. I have a hard time believing my opinions are worth any weight, especially when they are about myself.

Long story short I was stable for about 3-4 years. Not cured, but my anxiety was under control unless I pushed myself into a new situation or had to hold down an appointment. Then I had some medication and reacted horrendously badly to it (IBS wise) and my anxiety went right back to day 1 where I was almost housebound, having panic attacks etc.

I was put on Remeron but the side effects were terrible so was switched to Cipramil/Citalopram which I had been on 3 years ago successfully. However this time around I reacted really badly to it so went back again and was switched to Sinequan (all this happened in the last 5 weeks).

Now I do suffer depression, most of it related to how bad the anxiety is and I have never felt suicidal before. About a week into the sinequan I noticed I was feeling very irritable and had no patience at all and sort of just...sad all day. My dose was increased from 10mg to 20mg (I know this is quite low) and this got the last of the anxiety under control but about 6 days in I noticed I was feeling way beyond sad almost all day. I stopped being able to cope with anything. Not my kids, not my husband, even just getting the groceries became such an overwhelming effort that I would get angry and fall apart over having to do it. So I dropped my dose back to the 10mg for the last week but the feelings of wanting to die are persisting on a daily basis. I have honestly never felt this low in my entire life. It's affecting my ability to be a good parent and any kind of a wife. I seem to have lost the ability to feel happy at all. Again, these feelings are all very new to me. I know how I've felt in the past when I've been depressed and it was nearly this bad.

So I took myself back to my GP again and he basically told me that there was no way I could blame the antidepressant for this because it's designed to treat depression not cause it. He told me I had to keep taking the sinequan because it was helping the anxiety (which I think is probably better anyway now that my reaction to that medication has finally passed) and that I should now take Lexapro as well. Lex. in the morning and the other at night.

Now the thought of requiring BOTH of these seems relatively heavy duty given that I spent the last 3-4 years okay. I feel like it's the sinequan that's making me feel this low and to then take another SSRI to counteract this seems insane. Does anyone think it's at all possible that it's the sinequan making me feel like this and that perhaps needing a cocktail in my case is overkill? Should I get a 2nd opinion on this? Am I just crazier than I thought or maybe not so much? 

I'm conscious of the fact that I would be in the same medical centre as my other doctor asking if I should do what he says which feels a little awkward but even my husband thinks there's a marked change in me since starting the sinequan and is the reason I went to the doctors today in the first place (he said he couldn't stand seeing me this miserable anymore and that I've never been like this in the entire 12 years we've been married). I do have a lot of other stuff going on in my life which my GP seems to think is the problem (I disagree, the other stuff is stressful but shouldn't be making me feel like I do) and I had a feeling he'd see it that way.

Sorry this is so long. Thank you for reading if you made it this far. I value your thoughts and opinions on this.
 

Edited by Jessamine
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Compared to mine, you are hardly on a heavy-duty cocktail. I recommend following the doctor's advice and trying the Lexapro. If in the future you feel like trying to come off the Sinequan, you can discuss it with your doctor. But now is not that time since you are still feeling bad.

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I don't think it is necessary to say what is a heavy duty cocktail, and what isn't.

 

I know where you are saying Jess, or atleast I believe so.

 

You have been suffering from anxiety after a remission for several years, so you sough treatment for you anxiety & mild (or attributed) depression. And after being on this medication your anxiety has gotten better, but your depression has worsened (to a pint it has never been to before)?

 

If you are not used to taking several medications, taking more than you are used to can be overwhelming (both sideaffects & realization wise). And I can see your concern on starting a second medication for depression, which might just be counteracting the sideaffects of the first medication. Being on several meds, to treat several issues, can be very tricky in that way.

 

I have never been on Doxepin, so I can not tell you about personal experiences. As well I honestly don't know much at all about TCAs. But I can say that mood changes, especially worsening depression, is a caution on the general population of Antidepressants (and also a huge red flag).

 

Its good you brought it up to your GP, but it seems he is a bit out of his league on the MI stuff (please, correct me if I am wrong). Have you thought about getting a steady Pdoc who can be in charge of your Mental Health treatment? I am one who more than a little understands the correlation between GI and MI, but it has helped me greatly to have a Pdoc who focus on my mental health specifically.

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Compared to mine, you are hardly on a heavy-duty cocktail. I recommend following the doctor's advice and trying the Lexapro. If in the future you feel like trying to come off the Sinequan, you can discuss it with your doctor. But now is not that time since you are still feeling bad.

Sorry, bad wording on my behalf. I guess I feel as though taking 2 different one's is heavy duty for me, given that I generally don't take anything other than the very rare xanax for it all so to go from that to 2 different medications in the space of 4 weeks is somewhat overwhelming (and a little scary, SSRI's generally don't like me much and it's very similar to citalopram which I've had both good and bad experiences with). Thank you for your input. It's very much appreciated.

 

I don't think it is necessary to say what is a heavy duty cocktail, and what isn't.

 

I know where you are saying Jess, or atleast I believe so.

 

You have been suffering from anxiety after a remission for several years, so you sough treatment for you anxiety & mild (or attributed) depression. And after being on this medication your anxiety has gotten better, but your depression has worsened (to a pint it has never been to before)?

 

If you are not used to taking several medications, taking more than you are used to can be overwhelming (both sideaffects & realization wise). And I can see your concern on starting a second medication for depression, which might just be counteracting the sideaffects of the first medication. Being on several meds, to treat several issues, can be very tricky in that way.

 

I have never been on Doxepin, so I can not tell you about personal experiences. As well I honestly don't know much at all about TCAs. But I can say that mood changes, especially worsening depression, is a caution on the general population of Antidepressants (and also a huge red flag).

 

Its good you brought it up to your GP, but it seems he is a bit out of his league on the MI stuff (please, correct me if I am wrong). Have you thought about getting a steady Pdoc who can be in charge of your Mental Health treatment? I am one who more than a little understands the correlation between GI and MI, but it has helped me greatly to have a Pdoc who focus on my mental health specifically.

Again, I apologize. As I said above, poor wording. Heavy duty for me, someone who is usually not medicated at all (I guess I meant it feels heavy duty in comparison rather than it actually being heavy duty, I was in a bit of a flap when I wrote it all down).

I too thought that worsening mood symptoms was generally a red flag which is why I went back to see him, but you are right, he's a GP and not one who specializes in mood disorders generally. I am perhaps a little out of his league. He did mention when I started the sinequan that if I had any problems with it he would refer me to a psychiatrist. He didn't seem very willing to do that today however. I get the impression that like a lot of GP's I see, they quickly tire of me because I seem to react badly to most medication (I have always been med. sensitive). Perhaps I should go and see my husbands doctor who seems a bit more willing to write referrals when he knows he's unable to undertake a specialist area himself.

Thank you for your thoughts. Again, much appreciated :)

Edited by Jessamine
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Lexapro is indeed similar to citalopram. If you've had some bad experiences with citalopram, be sure to tell your doctor because, as my doctor explained it to me, Lexapro has the same psychoactive molecule as citalopram (same psychoactive isomer). Perhaps your doctor can come up with a different augmentation strategy to help you feel better.

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Piping in to say I agree with everything the girl has said. Worsening depression after starting an AD is a potentially serious adverse event, and it worries me that your GP doesn't seem to take it seriously and doesn't really sound like she's familiar with these meds. If you can get in to see a real pdoc, I would do so as soon as you can.

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Lexapro is indeed similar to citalopram. If you've had some bad experiences with citalopram, be sure to tell your doctor because, as my doctor explained it to me, Lexapro has the same psychoactive molecule as citalopram (same psychoactive isomer). Perhaps your doctor can come up with a different augmentation strategy to help you feel better.

I know :( He wanted me back on the citalopram even though I told him I lay in bed for 5 hours straight in a constant state of panic and my stomach was killing me so bad I couldn't eat or sit but I refused and said I'd rather take anything but. Because I've had success with cital. 3 years ago I guess he wanted to stick with it or something...

 

Piping in to say I agree with everything the girl has said. Worsening depression after starting an AD is a potentially serious adverse event, and it worries me that your GP doesn't seem to take it seriously and doesn't really sound like she's familiar with these meds. If you can get in to see a real pdoc, I would do so as soon as you can.

Thank you! This is the part that worried me the most. I've had some pretty low moments in life but not like these where I just feel hopeless and completely void of all happiness or the chance that happiness may EVER be felt again. I think he just goes through whatever table the computer gives him and rules out anything I've reacted really badly to in the past and picks out of whatever is left. I felt like he was sick of me and just wanted me out the door to be honest. He used to ask me to come back in a few days or a week for a checkup when starting a new med but he just sent me out the door with this script today and no mention of any kind of follow up. I think I will go and see someone else before I fill it and start them.

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Just wanted to say I read what you wrote and highly recommend seeing a pdoc.

 

 

So I took myself back to my GP again and he basically told me that there was no way I could blame the antidepressant for this because it's designed to treat depression not cause it.

 

I think you could blame the AD; not all meds react the same way with everyone.  Just because it is designed to treat depression doesn't mean it will 100% necessarily work for that.

 

I just had an experience with another med, that gave me the total opposite effect that it was known to give.  So not all meds work just because they are labeled to do so for something specific, IMO.

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Just wanted to say I read what you wrote and highly recommend seeing a pdoc.

 

 

So I took myself back to my GP again and he basically told me that there was no way I could blame the antidepressant for this because it's designed to treat depression not cause it.

 

I think you could blame the AD; not all meds react the same way with everyone.  Just because it is designed to treat depression doesn't mean it will 100% necessarily work for that.

 

I just had an experience with another med, that gave me the total opposite effect that it was known to give.  So not all meds work just because they are labeled to do so for something specific, IMO.

Thanks melissaw72. I seem to get strange side effects from meds (sometimes one's my old GP back where I used to live used to have to call the company about to confirm) so this wouldn't be the first time. I guess I just need to find a GP who will listen to me and give me a referral to a pdoc for next year (I doubt anyone will be seeing anyone this close to Christmas).

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Well I would get a second opinion from a psychiatrist (pdoc). They are specialists trained in the MI concerns.

 

And the sinequin could very well be causing your suicidal thoughts and low mood. I'm disheartened that a dr would tell you otherwise.

 

The national library of medicine states that "Changes in behavior, or thoughts of hurting yourself or others" is a side effect of the sinequin.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMHT0010029/?report=details#side_effects

 

If I were you I'd print that page out and take it to your dr. Wait, no don't even go back to that dr. For pete's sake! I'm angry that he would treat you that way. He is no specialist. He is not a pdoc. If he doesn't know that much at least about that AD then screw him! Find a good pdoc like I said earlier.

 

"Changes in behavior" could definitely mean lower mood and not feeling like doing things like grocery shopping. And for sure if you are having suicidal thoughts get in to see a pdoc asap.

 

I wish you all the luck in the world! Feel better soon! I'll be thinking of you!

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And just wanted to add that I wasted over a year seeing my GP only about my crazies. It was a complete waste of my time, money, and energy. Now getting help for the first time, I do not regret that and I feel the GP is a good first stepping stone to rule out physical causes (such as thyroid issues) that may be causing mood wackiness.

 

My GP ruled out physical causes first. Then proceeded to put me on AD after AD after AD. All the while saying she should "probably just refer me to a psychiatrist." AD's only made things worse for me and I became agitated and impulsive and hypomanic on the last one I tried with her. I said to myself, "screw it" right then and there and didn't go back to see her ever again. I kept taking the med though and decided I should seek out the help of a pdoc as soon as possible because I was miserable. I was diagnosed BP and finally got put on proper meds. I was later properly diagnosed SZA BP type.

 

It is a journey for sure to find the right meds and the right diagnosis (although treating symptoms is the way to go) and the right pdoc/tdoc, etc.

 

Sorry I'll stop ranting now!!!!!

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Thank you so much Wonderful.Cheese! You're right, I do need to see someone else. This is the second time in 2 weeks I've been dismissed (the first was a dismissal of my daughter despite having recommendations from her school counsellor, school teacher and school principal that she seek outside therapy) and now this. I haven't discontinued the sinequan but I don't think I'll start the lexapro and you're right about needing to see a pdoc as well. He's told me the last 2 times I've seen him that he'll refer me to one but then he doesn't. GP's are useful for many things but prescribing drugs they don't know a lot about not so much....and he's prescribing without me having an official diagnosis. I know I have GAD (that was diagnosed by a doctor as was the panic attacks and agoraphobia but not much else has ever been looked into, mostly just had SSRI's thrown at it).

Things are definitely seeming harder than before. Today my husband asked me to drop lunch in to him at work on the way home and I got so angry about it it was ridiculous. I just couldn't see how I could possibly make stopping in at his workplace on the way home work (with a car full of groceries and Christmas chocolates for the parents). Yes it needed to be juggled but it shouldn't have made me feel like the world was ending.

I'll keep up with it for now under the watchful eye of the other half and take myself to the doctor tomorrow or Friday for a referral (a new doctor that is).

Thanks again everyone!

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Thank you so much Wonderful.Cheese! You're right, I do need to see someone else. This is the second time in 2 weeks I've been dismissed (the first was a dismissal of my daughter despite having recommendations from her school counsellor, school teacher and school principal that she seek outside therapy) and now this. I haven't discontinued the sinequan but I don't think I'll start the lexapro and you're right about needing to see a pdoc as well. He's told me the last 2 times I've seen him that he'll refer me to one but then he doesn't. GP's are useful for many things but prescribing drugs they don't know a lot about not so much....and he's prescribing without me having an official diagnosis. I know I have GAD (that was diagnosed by a doctor as was the panic attacks and agoraphobia but not much else has ever been looked into, mostly just had SSRI's thrown at it).

I'll keep up with it for now under the watchful eye of the other half and take myself to the doctor tomorrow or Friday for a referral (a new doctor that is).

Thanks again everyone!

 

Can you perhaps call the GP's office and say that he/she had promised a referral for a pdoc, and see if you can't get them to recommend someone over the phone or leave a referral to be picked up? It seems a shame for you to have to spend another copay for a GP if you don't have to. Though maybe if it will take a bit of time to get in with a pdoc seeing another GP is a good idea, given how bad you are feeling.

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Can you perhaps call the GP's office and say that he/she had promised a referral for a pdoc, and see if you can't get them to recommend someone over the phone or leave a referral to be picked up? It seems a shame for you to have to spend another copay for a GP if you don't have to. Though maybe if it will take a bit of time to get in with a pdoc seeing another GP is a good idea, given how bad you are feeling.

 

^THIS is a great idea IMO and would save you time and money.  I would think the process of getting a referral and then finding a pdoc/setting up an appt wouldn't take too long if you are feeling really bad.  Sometimes DRs save appt spaces for emergencies.

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For the record Jess, I was actually referring to jt07 initially about comparing cocktails (sorry jt, I reacted to your comment more negatively than Jessamine's).

 

Every persons biology & genetics are different; so we retain & react to different meds in different ways. Just because you are on less meds than another person, it does not mean your medications are causing any more or less sideaffects. Especially when you are new to the med-go-round, or medications in general.

 

And I will end in saying to keep on that doctor about that referral ;) I don't remember what country you are in, but certain medical insurances allow you to call straight to hem for referrals. If you get nothing out of your GP, it may be an option to seek a different route to get the proper treatment you need.

 

Edit: I see my phone call idea, is definitely not unique :P

Edited by the girl
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Thank you so much Wonderful.Cheese! You're right, I do need to see someone else. This is the second time in 2 weeks I've been dismissed (the first was a dismissal of my daughter despite having recommendations from her school counsellor, school teacher and school principal that she seek outside therapy) and now this. I haven't discontinued the sinequan but I don't think I'll start the lexapro and you're right about needing to see a pdoc as well. He's told me the last 2 times I've seen him that he'll refer me to one but then he doesn't. GP's are useful for many things but prescribing drugs they don't know a lot about not so much....and he's prescribing without me having an official diagnosis. I know I have GAD (that was diagnosed by a doctor as was the panic attacks and agoraphobia but not much else has ever been looked into, mostly just had SSRI's thrown at it).

I'll keep up with it for now under the watchful eye of the other half and take myself to the doctor tomorrow or Friday for a referral (a new doctor that is).

Thanks again everyone!

 

Can you perhaps call the GP's office and say that he/she had promised a referral for a pdoc, and see if you can't get them to recommend someone over the phone or leave a referral to be picked up? It seems a shame for you to have to spend another copay for a GP if you don't have to. Though maybe if it will take a bit of time to get in with a pdoc seeing another GP is a good idea, given how bad you are feeling.

 

No, it's one of those new medical centres with about 20 doctors and they don't take appointments. Likewise you can't ask the reception staff to do anything at all. One of the pitfalls. On the bright side it's all bulk billed through medicare so I'm not out of pocket, just time (time being the minimum 3 hours wait you usually have when you walk in the door unless it's a REALLY good day). Thank you though, this would be helpful to people in the US. I'll definitely see another GP.

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Can you perhaps call the GP's office and say that he/she had promised a referral for a pdoc, and see if you can't get them to recommend someone over the phone or leave a referral to be picked up? It seems a shame for you to have to spend another copay for a GP if you don't have to. Though maybe if it will take a bit of time to get in with a pdoc seeing another GP is a good idea, given how bad you are feeling.

 

^THIS is a great idea IMO and would save you time and money.  I would think the process of getting a referral and then finding a pdoc/setting up an appt wouldn't take too long if you are feeling really bad.  Sometimes DRs save appt spaces for emergencies.

 

Thank you melissaw! As said above, things work a little differently here. They used to be able to take calls and give out referrals but they refuse to do that now :( The new system in these giant medical centres sucks. I can see another doctor, I just have to sit down there and wait.

 

For the record Jess, I was actually referring to jt07 initially about comparing cocktails (sorry jt, I reacted to your comment more negatively than Jessamine's).

 

Every persons biology & genetics are different; so we retain & react to different meds in different ways. Just because you are on less meds than another person, it does not mean your medications are causing any more or less sideaffects. Especially when you are new to the med-go-round, or medications in general.

 

And I will end in saying to keep on that doctor about that referral ;) I don't remember what country you are in, but certain medical insurances allow you to call straight to hem for referrals. If you get nothing out of your GP, it may be an option to seek a different route to get the proper treatment you need.

All good :) And yes, they do sadly and I am quite new in terms of finding something that works. Most of  the meds I tried were about 10 years ago. 3 years ago I was on citalopram and that mostly worked well for 9 months but my body seems to hate it now that I've tried it again.

I will head in and ask for a referral. I know my husbands doctor won't have a problem giving me one. He's pretty easy going. I only got tied up with this new doctor because he was away overseas and I had an emergency.

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Thank you melissaw! As said above, things work a little differently here. They used to be able to take calls and give out referrals but they refuse to do that now :( The new system in these giant medical centres sucks. I can see another doctor, I just have to sit down there and wait.

 

That sucks you cant' do things over the phone, especially when you just saw your DR.  I hope everything works out :)

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Thank you melissaw! As said above, things work a little differently here. They used to be able to take calls and give out referrals but they refuse to do that now :( The new system in these giant medical centres sucks. I can see another doctor, I just have to sit down there and wait.

 

That sucks you cant' do things over the phone, especially when you just saw your DR.  I hope everything works out :)

 

It really does! Especially when you've just seen them and forgot to get your script (or they forgot to print it) and then you have to go sit back down there for another 3 or 4 hours. And thank you. I'll let you know how I get on :)

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