Clozapine withdrawal

[MiaB]

Does anyone have experiences to share with regard to tapering off/quitting clozapine?  I am having a really hard time with this. 

I went from 200mg to 150mg to 100mg with some discomfort, but nothing dramatic, but the next steps (to 50mg and then zero) have proven horrible.  It has been a nighttime med for me, and I don't think I realised just how much of a part it has played in helping my mind shut up and let me rest, until trying to reduce it and then quit.  I lasted just a few days without it before cracking and calling pdoc, who has me back on it and is talking about discontinuing in much smaller increments (12.5mg at a time, for example).

I hate this - I feel trapped.

 

[melissaw72]

How long have you been on it?  I was on it for a few months before stopping it, and Idk my ending dose (it wasn't low though ... pdoc kept increasing my dose).  But I remember having to wean down very fast because my WBC count was close to 0.0.  And I didn't have any side effects other than feeling better when I was totally off of it.

1 hour ago, MiaB said:

calling pdoc, who has me back on it and is talking about discontinuing in much smaller increments (12.5mg at a time, for example).

I think this is a really good idea. 

I know prozac isn't in the same category, but it sounds like a similar weaning off that you are going through.  I weaned off from being at 80 mg, and it took about 10-12 months to finally get to 0 without needing it.  Not saying that will happen to you though.  It was like 2 steps forward and one step back for me.  That kind of sounds to me like something you might be going through?

[MiaB]

Thanks Melissa.  This is actually my second time around with clozapine - I was on it a few years ago, but not for a long period or high dose and I can't recall going through anything like this. I've been back on it since about March last year, when I started seeing a new pdoc.  So that would make it about 18 months - plenty of time to become dependent on it.

You're probably right in that I may have to resign myself to going through this really, really slowly.

[Virgo]

Dear Anyone on Clozaril,

I am a survivor of this medication after being on high dosages for 14 years.  First of all, it is a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  Let me say that again, its a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  If you are going back and forth to other medications, this medication is not for you.  Let me say that again, this medication is not for you.  If you want to get off this medication safely, or any psych medication, there is one one facility in the United States of America to handle these medications.  The facility is called Alternative to Meds Center in Sendona, AZ.  

Step 1:  Do not ever leave a therapist while on these medications.  If you have left, go back.  These medications help control the symptom, they don't heal the symptom.  Without a therapist who could help you heal the symptom, you could be stuck on the medication for a long time.  Then, your stuck trying to come off on your own.  Psychiatrists are taught how to increase your medication, not decrease it no matter what the FDA says.  

Step 2:  Ask your therapist if they agree or disagree with the diagnosis of the psychiatrist and the medication they are prescribing.  Especially if they are prescribing multiple ones.  Only see a therapist who specializes in the diagnosis, or you could be wasting your time.  For example, Clozaril, you should only be seeing a licensed therapist who specializes in psychosis.  If on Ativan or Klonopin, see a therapist who specializes in Anxiety or Depression.  But, any therapist should do to ask basic questions like, "do you think I have depression," or "do you think I hear voices."  

Step 3:  Get a genetic test.  If your psychiatrist has not given you one, confront them about it.  If they won't do it, see your General Practitioner and ask them about it.  If they don't know about it, educate them.  Your genetic test will tell you if your on the right medication.  Without a genetic test the chances of you experiencing side effects dramatically increases, especially if the psychiatrist is doing an injection once a month.  Search for genetic test based off your insurance.  For example, Medicare and GeneSight.  

Step 4:   If you feel your mental health symptoms get better when you go to lower dosages of any psych medication, Your Drug May Be Your Problem, by Dr. Peter Breggin.  

Step 5:  If anything I just wrote between Step 1- Step 4 applies to you. You might consider Alternative to Meds Center.  If the medication is not meant for you, they can get you off.  You will have to be willing to put your life on hold for a brief time, but as a survivor of Clozaril and multiple psych medications, in the end its worth it.  The program is a self choice program, and no one can force you to do it.  If your cannot afford it, think about getting a loan or financing it.  If you need financial assistance, ask a family member who is close to you for help and show desire and enthusiasm to want to go.  No one who hasn't ever been on psych medication knows what it feels like no matter what they read about them.  

Step 6:  Stay off the internet reading about any psych medications, the side effects that is associated with them, or any articles written by doctors on how they can help you.  Truly they cannot help you or make any medical doctor decisions for you.  There is legal consequences for any medical doctor telling you what to do over the internet.  Medical doctors over the internet will only be supportive digitally but not psychically.  Stick to a therapist and first follow my steps.  

Step 7: Make Eckhart Tolle your new mentor.  Watch all his youtube videos.  Make him apart of your life.  Start with:  The Best Eckhart Tolle Talk (1hr 30min) Power of Now, A New Earth.  1:26:28

Step 8:  Reread Step 1 through Step 7.  

Step 9:  If your are experiencing Zaps, Shocks, Electric Shocks, or ruminating zips sounds in your brain that won't turn off caused by tapering psych medication see a "Neurological Chiropractor."  

I am a survivor of the most toxic psych medication on the planet, Clozaril, and I know what I'm talking about.  If you truly in your heart want to try to get off any psych medication, I have presented my 14 year journey with a summary in 7 steps.  

P.S. Keep the conversations educational and supportive on this website.  I won't ever come back to this website.  Life is hard on these medications without any true support.  Psychiatry is a money making system and I have studied it more than anyone.  As an educated human being, I fight that there has to be more to psychiatry than money such as lack of education.  But it is all about money.  Despite my beliefs, in some situations these psych medications are life savers.  The problem is they are over prescribed by salesmen, and they are educated to do so.  Neurobiology and Neuroscience will eventually delete the psychiatrist, and human beings that are involved in the money making system will eventually go bankrupt.  

Take Control of Your Life or Someone Else Will (the psychiatrist)

Good Luck on Your Journey

Virgo 

 

 

[Wonderful.Cheese]

1 hour ago, Virgo said:

Dear Anyone on Clozaril,

I am a survivor of this medication after being on high dosages for 14 years.  First of all, it is a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  Let me say that again, its a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  If you are going back and forth to other medications, this medication is not for you.  Let me say that again, this medication is not for you.  If you want to get off this medication safely, or any psych medication, there is one one facility in the United States of America to handle these medications.  The facility is called Alternative to Meds Center in Sendona, AZ.  

Step 1:  Do not ever leave a therapist while on these medications.  If you have left, go back.  These medications help control the symptom, they don't heal the symptom.  Without a therapist who could help you heal the symptom, you could be stuck on the medication for a long time.  Then, your stuck trying to come off on your own.  Psychiatrists are taught how to increase your medication, not decrease it no matter what the FDA says.  

Step 2:  Ask your therapist if they agree or disagree with the diagnosis of the psychiatrist and the medication they are prescribing.  Especially if they are prescribing multiple ones.  Only see a therapist who specializes in the diagnosis, or you could be wasting your time.  For example, Clozaril, you should only be seeing a licensed therapist who specializes in psychosis.  If on Ativan or Klonopin, see a therapist who specializes in Anxiety or Depression.  But, any therapist should do to ask basic questions like, "do you think I have depression," or "do you think I hear voices."  

Step 3:  Get a genetic test.  If your psychiatrist has not given you one, confront them about it.  If they won't do it, see your General Practitioner and ask them about it.  If they don't know about it, educate them.  Your genetic test will tell you if your on the right medication.  Without a genetic test the chances of you experiencing side effects dramatically increases, especially if the psychiatrist is doing an injection once a month.  Search for genetic test based off your insurance.  For example, Medicare and GeneSight.  

Step 4:   If you feel your mental health symptoms get better when you go to lower dosages of any psych medication, Your Drug May Be Your Problem, by Dr. Peter Breggin.  

Step 5:  If anything I just wrote between Step 1- Step 4 applies to you. You might consider Alternative to Meds Center.  If the medication is not meant for you, they can get you off.  You will have to be willing to put your life on hold for a brief time, but as a survivor of Clozaril and multiple psych medications, in the end its worth it.  The program is a self choice program, and no one can force you to do it.  If your cannot afford it, think about getting a loan or financing it.  If you need financial assistance, ask a family member who is close to you for help and show desire and enthusiasm to want to go.  No one who hasn't ever been on psych medication knows what it feels like no matter what they read about them.  

Step 6:  Stay off the internet reading about any psych medications, the side effects that is associated with them, or any articles written by doctors on how they can help you.  Truly they cannot help you or make any medical doctor decisions for you.  There is legal consequences for any medical doctor telling you what to do over the internet.  Medical doctors over the internet will only be supportive digitally but not psychically.  Stick to a therapist and first follow my steps.  

Step 7: Make Eckhart Tolle your new mentor.  Watch all his youtube videos.  Make him apart of your life.  Start with:  The Best Eckhart Tolle Talk (1hr 30min) Power of Now, A New Earth.  1:26:28

Step 8:  Reread Step 1 through Step 7.  

Step 9:  If your are experiencing Zaps, Shocks, Electric Shocks, or ruminating zips sounds in your brain that won't turn off caused by tapering psych medication see a "Neurological Chiropractor."  

I am a survivor of the most toxic psych medication on the planet, Clozaril, and I know what I'm talking about.  If you truly in your heart want to try to get off any psych medication, I have presented my 14 year journey with a summary in 7 steps.  

P.S. Keep the conversations educational and supportive on this website.  I won't ever come back to this website.  Life is hard on these medications without any true support.  Psychiatry is a money making system and I have studied it more than anyone.  As an educated human being, I fight that there has to be more to psychiatry than money such as lack of education.  But it is all about money.  Despite my beliefs, in some situations these psych medications are life savers.  The problem is they are over prescribed by salesmen, and they are educated to do so.  Neurobiology and Neuroscience will eventually delete the psychiatrist, and human beings that are involved in the money making system will eventually go bankrupt.  

Take Control of Your Life or Someone Else Will (the psychiatrist)

Good Luck on Your Journey

Virgo 

 

 

Ok. I’ll bite. Here’s a different viewpoint. I just started clozapine. I have treatment resistant SZA/psychosis. But there are bipolar folks here who take clozapine.

Why in the world would I finance or take out a loan to go to something called “Alternative to meds center”? I mean, screw that! If I want off meds I’d do it myself for free and have done so in the past! Not that I recommend that. You should do that with your pdoc’s guidance of course. Bad things like seizures can happen if you cold turkey meds or stop them too fast. So talk to your pdoc for sure.

Therapy is great but the right meds are often needed and certainly necessary to make one able to succeed in therapy.

But I digress. This is a pro meds and pro treatment site. Many of us are treatment resistant. Many of us struggle to take our meds (because of delusions or anxiety or depression, mania, etc). Many of us would be dead right now without meds. So we don’t need to hear about some anti psychiatry BS “Alternative to meds center.” I’m glad you don’t need meds and can do without them (yay for you), but many of us here cannot do without them. Like I said many of us here would be dead right now without them.

So as for me, despite your words, I will continue to take my meds (including clozapine) because I mostly don’t want the courts involved in my life again. Also I’d hurt my family, like a lot. So there you have it. A different viewpoint.

 

[DammitJanet]

1 hour ago, Virgo said:

Dear Anyone on Clozaril,

I am a survivor of this medication after being on high dosages for 14 years.  First of all, it is a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  Let me say that again, its a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  If you are going back and forth to other medications, this medication is not for you.  Let me say that again, this medication is not for you.  If you want to get off this medication safely, or any psych medication, there is one one facility in the United States of America to handle these medications.  The facility is called Alternative to Meds Center in Sendona, AZ.  

Step 1:  Do not ever leave a therapist while on these medications.  If you have left, go back.  These medications help control the symptom, they don't heal the symptom.  Without a therapist who could help you heal the symptom, you could be stuck on the medication for a long time.  Then, your stuck trying to come off on your own.  Psychiatrists are taught how to increase your medication, not decrease it no matter what the FDA says.  

Step 2:  Ask your therapist if they agree or disagree with the diagnosis of the psychiatrist and the medication they are prescribing.  Especially if they are prescribing multiple ones.  Only see a therapist who specializes in the diagnosis, or you could be wasting your time.  For example, Clozaril, you should only be seeing a licensed therapist who specializes in psychosis.  If on Ativan or Klonopin, see a therapist who specializes in Anxiety or Depression.  But, any therapist should do to ask basic questions like, "do you think I have depression," or "do you think I hear voices."  

Step 3:  Get a genetic test.  If your psychiatrist has not given you one, confront them about it.  If they won't do it, see your General Practitioner and ask them about it.  If they don't know about it, educate them.  Your genetic test will tell you if your on the right medication.  Without a genetic test the chances of you experiencing side effects dramatically increases, especially if the psychiatrist is doing an injection once a month.  Search for genetic test based off your insurance.  For example, Medicare and GeneSight.  

Step 4:   If you feel your mental health symptoms get better when you go to lower dosages of any psych medication, Your Drug May Be Your Problem, by Dr. Peter Breggin.  

Step 5:  If anything I just wrote between Step 1- Step 4 applies to you. You might consider Alternative to Meds Center.  If the medication is not meant for you, they can get you off.  You will have to be willing to put your life on hold for a brief time, but as a survivor of Clozaril and multiple psych medications, in the end its worth it.  The program is a self choice program, and no one can force you to do it.  If your cannot afford it, think about getting a loan or financing it.  If you need financial assistance, ask a family member who is close to you for help and show desire and enthusiasm to want to go.  No one who hasn't ever been on psych medication knows what it feels like no matter what they read about them.  

Step 6:  Stay off the internet reading about any psych medications, the side effects that is associated with them, or any articles written by doctors on how they can help you.  Truly they cannot help you or make any medical doctor decisions for you.  There is legal consequences for any medical doctor telling you what to do over the internet.  Medical doctors over the internet will only be supportive digitally but not psychically.  Stick to a therapist and first follow my steps.  

Step 7: Make Eckhart Tolle your new mentor.  Watch all his youtube videos.  Make him apart of your life.  Start with:  The Best Eckhart Tolle Talk (1hr 30min) Power of Now, A New Earth.  1:26:28

Step 8:  Reread Step 1 through Step 7.  

Step 9:  If your are experiencing Zaps, Shocks, Electric Shocks, or ruminating zips sounds in your brain that won't turn off caused by tapering psych medication see a "Neurological Chiropractor."  

I am a survivor of the most toxic psych medication on the planet, Clozaril, and I know what I'm talking about.  If you truly in your heart want to try to get off any psych medication, I have presented my 14 year journey with a summary in 7 steps.  

P.S. Keep the conversations educational and supportive on this website.  I won't ever come back to this website.  Life is hard on these medications without any true support.  Psychiatry is a money making system and I have studied it more than anyone.  As an educated human being, I fight that there has to be more to psychiatry than money such as lack of education.  But it is all about money.  Despite my beliefs, in some situations these psych medications are life savers.  The problem is they are over prescribed by salesmen, and they are educated to do so.  Neurobiology and Neuroscience will eventually delete the psychiatrist, and human beings that are involved in the money making system will eventually go bankrupt.  

Take Control of Your Life or Someone Else Will (the psychiatrist)

Good Luck on Your Journey

Virgo 

 

 

 

Bon Voyage!

Edited October 8, 2018 by DammitJanet

[CeremonyNewOrder]

6 hours ago, Virgo said:

Dear Anyone on Clozaril,

I am a survivor of this medication after being on high dosages for 14 years.  First of all, it is a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  Let me say that again, its a last resort anti-psychotic for severe schizophrenia.  If you are going back and forth to other medications, this medication is not for you.  Let me say that again, this medication is not for you.  If you want to get off this medication safely, or any psych medication, there is one one facility in the United States of America to handle these medications.  The facility is called Alternative to Meds Center in Sendona, AZ.  

Step 1:  Do not ever leave a therapist while on these medications.  If you have left, go back.  These medications help control the symptom, they don't heal the symptom.  Without a therapist who could help you heal the symptom, you could be stuck on the medication for a long time.  Then, your stuck trying to come off on your own.  Psychiatrists are taught how to increase your medication, not decrease it no matter what the FDA says.  

Step 2:  Ask your therapist if they agree or disagree with the diagnosis of the psychiatrist and the medication they are prescribing.  Especially if they are prescribing multiple ones.  Only see a therapist who specializes in the diagnosis, or you could be wasting your time.  For example, Clozaril, you should only be seeing a licensed therapist who specializes in psychosis.  If on Ativan or Klonopin, see a therapist who specializes in Anxiety or Depression.  But, any therapist should do to ask basic questions like, "do you think I have depression," or "do you think I hear voices."  

Step 3:  Get a genetic test.  If your psychiatrist has not given you one, confront them about it.  If they won't do it, see your General Practitioner and ask them about it.  If they don't know about it, educate them.  Your genetic test will tell you if your on the right medication.  Without a genetic test the chances of you experiencing side effects dramatically increases, especially if the psychiatrist is doing an injection once a month.  Search for genetic test based off your insurance.  For example, Medicare and GeneSight.  

Step 4:   If you feel your mental health symptoms get better when you go to lower dosages of any psych medication, Your Drug May Be Your Problem, by Dr. Peter Breggin.  

Step 5:  If anything I just wrote between Step 1- Step 4 applies to you. You might consider Alternative to Meds Center.  If the medication is not meant for you, they can get you off.  You will have to be willing to put your life on hold for a brief time, but as a survivor of Clozaril and multiple psych medications, in the end its worth it.  The program is a self choice program, and no one can force you to do it.  If your cannot afford it, think about getting a loan or financing it.  If you need financial assistance, ask a family member who is close to you for help and show desire and enthusiasm to want to go.  No one who hasn't ever been on psych medication knows what it feels like no matter what they read about them.  

Step 6:  Stay off the internet reading about any psych medications, the side effects that is associated with them, or any articles written by doctors on how they can help you.  Truly they cannot help you or make any medical doctor decisions for you.  There is legal consequences for any medical doctor telling you what to do over the internet.  Medical doctors over the internet will only be supportive digitally but not psychically.  Stick to a therapist and first follow my steps.  

Step 7: Make Eckhart Tolle your new mentor.  Watch all his youtube videos.  Make him apart of your life.  Start with:  The Best Eckhart Tolle Talk (1hr 30min) Power of Now, A New Earth.  1:26:28

Step 8:  Reread Step 1 through Step 7.  

Step 9:  If your are experiencing Zaps, Shocks, Electric Shocks, or ruminating zips sounds in your brain that won't turn off caused by tapering psych medication see a "Neurological Chiropractor."  

I am a survivor of the most toxic psych medication on the planet, Clozaril, and I know what I'm talking about.  If you truly in your heart want to try to get off any psych medication, I have presented my 14 year journey with a summary in 7 steps.  

P.S. Keep the conversations educational and supportive on this website.  I won't ever come back to this website.  Life is hard on these medications without any true support.  Psychiatry is a money making system and I have studied it more than anyone.  As an educated human being, I fight that there has to be more to psychiatry than money such as lack of education.  But it is all about money.  Despite my beliefs, in some situations these psych medications are life savers.  The problem is they are over prescribed by salesmen, and they are educated to do so.  Neurobiology and Neuroscience will eventually delete the psychiatrist, and human beings that are involved in the money making system will eventually go bankrupt.  

Take Control of Your Life or Someone Else Will (the psychiatrist)

Good Luck on Your Journey

Virgo 

 

 

The alternative to meds obviously hasn't helped you out. And no thinker no matter how great can stop psychotic and manic symptoms without medication. Clozapine has saved me. I have not been in the hospital again since being on it. I do get some sedation and weight gain but most antipsychotics do that. I really shouldnt be wasting my time on you but I fucking hate anti-med people who misrepresent psych meds and feed off the fears of vulnerable people and try and sell their crackpot untested supplements. Shame on you!

[MiaB]

As the OP, who started this thread more than 2 years ago, I feel I should comment to say that my circumstances changed over time, and clozapine is now one of the mainstays of my drug regimen. However, even if it weren't, your fear mongering has no place on this pro- treatment site.

[Cerberus]

Virgo -

Rubbish. Let me say that again. Rubbish.

[San]

I say Hokum.

That "advice" is just.. literally deadly. I blame the stigma.Who wants to be mentally ill?

I'm glad clozapine works, @MiaB. It's a serious drug, but it has serious results.

[Cerberus]

Members -

The Moderating Team is of the opinion that the post from member "Virgo" above may be spam for this "Alternative Meds Center" and not a genuine first-person account. We caution readers to assume it as such unless and until Virgo returns to prove that he or she is not a spammer. In any event, the post is not in keeping with the CB philosophy, and we strongly encourage everyone to give it a big, juicy raspberry, thus:  :Ð~ PTHBPTHTHPB!!

[Gearhead]

On 10/8/2018 at 1:48 PM, Virgo said:

Step 6:  Stay off the internet reading about any psych medications, the side effects that is associated with them, or any articles written by doctors on how they can help you.  

Are you truly unaware of the irony of this sentence?