Dweii Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 Maybe this is normal, maybe not. I definately don't want to diagnose all of my problems as part of a disorder. Normal people are weird too. I get these very weird, kind of sick thoughts at completely random times. Like today in yoga class, I suddenly imagined someone cutting my leg of with an axe. Stuff like that. The thoughts feel very real and not irrational at all too. What the hell is this? Is this just a normal quirk or is it something more? I added "intrusive" to the topic to help with later searches for this subject. --V.E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvia Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 Helena I remember, a very long time ago, that I was sitting in a meeting and all of a sudden had this thought that someone was going to break in and slaughter us all - yuk. Lots of fear I guess, and paranoia abounded at that time. Let it go, it'll pass. I had an awful hallucination a week or so ago, and someone (I wish I could remember) posted, Weird Brain, and that worked for me. Keep the faith, Love, Sylvia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celestia Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 Maybe this is normal, maybe not. I definately don't want to diagnose all of my problems as part of a disorder. Normal people are weird too. I get these very weird, kind of sick thoughts at completely random times. Like today in yoga class, I suddenly imagined someone cutting my leg of with an axe. Stuff like that. The thoughts feel very real and not irrational at all too. What the hell is this? Is this just a normal quirk or is it something more? <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Helena, I almost literally killed myself after I had my first kid. I used to have thoughts of bashing his little infant cranium on the sidewalk, throwing him out of the car and WORSE, sick stuff. Twisted shit from the past. But I didn't have a clue about diddly then. Not post partum depression, not pregnancy/labor/delivery induced PTSD, nothing. I thought I was a sick fuck and need to give my baby away and go die. That was my first serious adult MDD episode. I perservered through treatment for him. External motivation is better than nothing. I used to wear a rubber band on my wrist. When I'd get those thoughts, and they were like Viewmaster, technicolor bullshit (all the acid), just pop in there. I would say, (like Mr. Rogers), thoughts are just thoughts. It's what we do with them, I'd snap my wrist and remind myself I was NOT going to prepetuate the cycle of violence and abuse handed down to me. And with a lot of therapy so far, they are okay. Weird, but, whaddya expect? LOL S9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solstar Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 I get those and assume it is part of my OCDness. If I am near a cliff I always get the urge to jump so I have to make myself move away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celestia Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 I get those and assume it is part of my OCDness. If I am near a cliff I always get the urge to jump so I have to make myself move away. <{POST_SNAPBACK}>That's different though, Jem? Am right? A parasympathetic system thingee that makes us want to spontaneously drive into a bridge abutement? Is it the same thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dweii Posted January 29, 2006 Author Share Posted January 29, 2006 I'm gonna assume it's somewhat normal. Even though I'm sure my assorted mental issues probably contribute to the thoughts. I had another one just now... I wondered what my parents would taste like. AHH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batou Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 My guess is that normal people, whoever they are, have disturbing thoughts and images pop into their head from time to time. I just don't know any normal people. I think people without some flavor of MI would never dare to speak about them. Would parents tate like chicken? Erika, sick question, I know but I am joking (I think) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jemini Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 I don't know what the hell any of it means, but I used to have sudden horrible images flash into my head too. Like I'd imagine mysefl smashing my skull on concrete steps that were over there. I definitely used to have the thing at the top of the Empire State Building or on a cliff (or at the top of the 3-story open tank at the New England Aquarium) where I'd start feeling really nervous that I might suddenly decide to jump. But none of this was ever really accompanied by actual fear or anger or anything, it was just random images. No idea what it means though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velvet Elvis Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 I've always attributed this phenomena to OCD, though for me it's not the sudden images so much as the fear that I must be a really fucked up person to have them pop into my head that becomes disabling. "Intrusive thoughts" is the term I believe. I wanna look a couple things up on this when I get back from doing laundry and may or may not move this thread to the OCD forum as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celestia Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 I don't know what the hell any of it means, but I used to have sudden horrible images flash into my head too. Like I'd imagine mysefl smashing my skull on concrete steps that were over there. I definitely used to have the thing at the top of the Empire State Building or on a cliff (or at the top of the 3-story open tank at the New England Aquarium) where I'd start feeling really nervous that I might suddenly decide to jump. But none of this was ever really accompanied by actual fear or anger or anything, it was just random images. No idea what it means though. <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Come on...back to Psych 101...how the parasympathetic (am I even saying the right system) system in our brains, the unconscious part, sends out these random impulses and involuntary muscle control, shit like that. Some help! I know I learned this. And not that long ago, that's the scary part! The parasympathetic nervous system. I'm too lazy to Google. That's bad. Oh well...just don't drive into a bridge, saw your legs off, jump of the empire state building or stick your head in an electric oven. You'll be alright. Buy rubber bands...Jem, ya on da weed? I wish that stuff worked for me <looks both ways for police> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 Hi Helena, Yup, I get those too. But I think you can be encouraged by the fact that even as you get this thought that is totally whackjob, your rational mind knows that the thought itself is whackjob. If you freak out and ruminate over it, you may encourage the thought to come back, but if you just acknowledge it and give it no further concern, it'll go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jemini Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 saturnine -- not on the weed for like a month. but don't want to threadjack here. pop over to my place if you like. on the springer board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weaseltine Cracker Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 What you describe are intrusive thoughts and are a symptom of OCD and other anxiety disorders. I've had these since I was a kid but I usually ignored them and the subsequent anxiety they caused. I never developed coping compulsions in response to the thoughts, which is what happens in full-blown OCD. I think of the thoughts as a sign of a creative mind. Some people go to horror films to get their heart beating; we can just dream them up and get the same effect. If the thoughts take over and cause great discomfort, then it is time to bring them up with a pro and go from there. --Weasel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dweii Posted January 30, 2006 Author Share Posted January 30, 2006 OCD? I've never had the diagnosis OCD, and I've had a couple. But I've always suspected I had some mild version of OCD. Then again, I think I have a mild version of pretty much everything. Another weird thing I have is that my left side of the body constantly feel as it will float away if I don't "ground it" by touching things with my left pinkie finger. Hmm. Sometimes I even feel the urge to touch people, when I'm not close to a wall or a suitable object. Doesn't this sound a bit OCD? I do it all the time. And I like order. I love Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathanupr Posted January 30, 2006 Share Posted January 30, 2006 the Concerta definitely exacerbates OCD.....so that might be something to look at as a cause in your OCD getting a bit more intense. I speak with experience of this. As i take a stim for my ADD and it intensifies my OCD issues, the intrustive thoughts go mad in my mind if i dont take another med to get the OCD down....... right now taking 5 mgs of Lexapro and 4 mgs of Gabitril at night is doing the trick (though the Gabitril is kickin my cognitive abilities a bit). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit37 Posted January 30, 2006 Share Posted January 30, 2006 BTW, how the hell do you treat OCD if you can't take antidepressants? My tdoc is tapering me down (off?) of zoloft (switching over to a depakote/lamictal mix). He started me on Risperdal to help clear my head. Wow, works very well, and I'm sleeping better. I'm feeling tinglings of OCD revving back up, but since I'm going through a meds change, and still titrating on the Risperdal, I guess that can be expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weaseltine Cracker Posted January 30, 2006 Share Posted January 30, 2006 I think there is a spectrum of OCD symptoms and behaviors. Lots of people have little rituals they perform when they have intrusive thoughts--to keep bad things from happening. OCD is diagnosed when the anxiety from the thoughts and the corresponding rituals take a significant amount of time and when they keep a person from "functioning". If you are just having passing intrusive thoughts that you find strange, but that you can let pass without trouble, then you probably don't need to worry about OCD. OCD thrives in a positive feedback loop situation: the thought triggers anxiety which leads to the action (compulsion), and when the action doesn't prevent the next occurence of the thought, greater anxiety arises and the action is tried again...and you just go in circles. If you are bothered too much by the thoughts, and/or have out of control compulsions, then you can try cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT). CBT works by gradually desensitizing you to the intrusive thoughts. For example someone with a cleanliness obsession might have to expose themself to a "dirty" environment and then resist the compulsion as long as possible, repeatedly. It's a slow reconditioning process. --Weasel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I have had really sick thoughts, and I was worried, I don't listen to aggressive music or watch horror movies or like violence or gore, I'm a bit of a peace loving wuss that way. But the more I got scared and repulsed, the more it went on, and it wasn't until I talked to health professionals and relatives and mentally ill people and Buddhists and basically other people that I realised it does happen to some extent to us all, it's not pathological. It didn't mean I secretly enjoyed it or was repressing it, or that I would be overtaken by it, or that I was possessed or a nutjob. We all have thoughts of all varieties and we can't always control it, we have to choose how we respond. M Scott Peck talks emotions and thoughts as slaves. If we are too harsh with them, they rise up and burn the house down when we let our guard down. If we are scared by them and let them ovverrule us they run riot too. So the trick is not to be too harsh ro too scared, but to observe and to stay cool as much as you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velvet Elvis Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 BTW, how the hell do you treat OCD if you can't take antidepressants? Therapy? What kind? I've learned some CBT tools that have helped. Seroquel has helped more with the thoughts than anything else. Check out the CBT Workbook by Hyman that is mentioned several places in this board. It's excellent. It's like six months of therapy without the uncomfortable chairs. It's the source for the OCD subtypes mentioned in the board description. I should really cite that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dweii Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Thanks for the book tip VE, I could really use some CBT I think, but I hate therapy. Maybe a book is the next best thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scream_phoenix Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 But the more I got scared and repulsed, the more it went on, and it wasn't until I talked to health professionals and relatives and mentally ill people and Buddhists <{POST_SNAPBACK}> i just thought it was funny that buddhists were the next step after mentally ill people when i first read that. i don't know why. but its probably the only thing that will make me smile today. i don't know if i like the 'slave' analogy either. isn't that a little too . . . 19th century? okay, just joking, not picking on you either. i just don't think its quite got it down as far as plantation (intrusive thought) discipline goes. you can't really control how you react to thoughts. you can rationalize a little bit after you've reacted, but your degree of sensitivity to the thoughts and your reaction is usually already set. so a moderate response is hard to achieve and even if you can keep it up for awhile, the thoughts won't go away. the only luck i've had when it came to the worst of my intrusive thoughts, is by confronting the anxiety and the thought(not the action themselves like jumping off the empire state building). its more like turning around and facing the thought squarely in teh face - and forcing an escalation in the anxiety. this was usually best achieved for me on paper - trying to get as graphic as i could with my fear, and just letting that take me wherever it would. usually - just through free association - my mind would think of so many tangents that it would get me out of the thought for the time being. and in the mean time a little bit of the anxiety was released. stress, and a whole bunch of other things can lead me back to a point where every thought is intrusive, but for me i've found really the only thing that relieved the anxiety was confronting the thought. or just getting out of the sensitive state of mind that reacts strongly to the intrusive thought. i don't know how close that is to the cbt workbook method, but maybe i can be arsed to clicking on the link. as far as the original question goes, it sounds a lot like ocd to me from the symptoms you described helena - just judging on my personal experience with ocd. but sometimes stress and anxiety can produce ocd like symptoms - and being neat/organized is a form of stress reduction. i wouldn't say you have to worry about throwing a whole nother diagnosis on yourself - i guess just be aware that stress and a sensitive mind can make the occasional intrusive thought a lot worse. if your original thought really bothers you - i'd try doing somethign like i described earlier- trying to 'flood' it out on a piece of paper. if it is just the occasional intrusive thought then it might not be worth it. nat turner y'all. i feel like i got a brain full of them. for some reason i'm itching to use more 19th century analogies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 You can't not think an intrusive thought, but I believe that you can control how you react how to it, being able to observe it and not just reacting by being upset by it is progress, from being terrified by or trying to repress these thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witchywoman Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I get this too. Usually its about my kids getting hurt. Like, I drop them on their head and their heads split open, or I pull their arm off, or some sick shit like that. I hate it. It's very disturbing to me. Thankfully, it's a rare thing for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robotlove29 Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Mine are impending visions of doom.... all of a sudden I feel like I have a "sixth sense" a car is suddenly going to run a red light and smash into my car and kill me. A plane is going to fall out of the sky, or a part of it (and yes I had this BEFORE donnie darko) is going to fall down on the highway or my house and kill me. I'm going to learn I am terminally ill with cancer and die within a few months....random shit like that.......completely irrational...but I still get scared. I think it's cause I've had a bunch of random bad shit happen to me all my life.....I've always felt like I was kind of a target for God or something... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scream_phoenix Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 You can't not think an intrusive thought, but I believe that you can control how you react how to it, being able to observe it and not just reacting by being upset by it is progress, from being terrified by or trying to repress these thoughts. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> yes, that is the progress that is intended - but you can't just achieve it by deciding 'okay i'm not going to overreact to this thought'. if its a serious reoccuring intrusive thought the only way to achieve that progress is by confronting it somehow, and draining it of its anxiety. moderation isn't really an option if its a serious anxiety producing thought. that's been my experience anyway. maybe others are more adept at on the spot mind control Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grousemouse Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 i get images like that too helena. i describe it a bit here: it's post 1478. the images are emotionless and painless. grouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velvet Elvis Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 The images/thought/ideas are fleeting and painless in and of themselves for me. It's only afterwards that I start to worry that I must be a seriously fucked up individual for having them. In my case my mind finds things that I find morally reprehensible and tortures me with them. I get images or ideas of doing them and then respond by being freaked out, thinking I don't deserve to live, etc. CBT has helped with responses to the thoughts. Seroquel has been the only med that reduced their frequency without making me a zombie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mechante Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 I have these kinds of thoughts, too. Last time I saw my psychiatrist I had this almost irrepressible urge to kick her - today I had the fleeting idea of licking her eyeball. Eww. And most of the time I have a bad reaction to this kind of thought. I don't really know if I should talk to my Dr. about it on Tuesday and see if we can increase my AP. Or my AD. I don't know what would help best. Anyway, just wanted to say I know how you feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velvet Elvis Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 I've had the eyeball one as well. It was a teacher though. I just suddenly thought about standing up in the middle of the lecture, walking to the front of the room, and licking her eyeball. Brains are weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimpmaster Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Everybody suffers from intusive thoughts. What differentiates those with OCD to those without is severity, frequency and most importantly, the way the person's mind deals with them. People with OCD tend to try and fight the thoughts through fear of them becoming real and this results in a high state of anxiety, more frequent intrusive thoughts and often more severe and disabling effects. Intrusive thoughts become clinical obsessions when they have reached a certain level of frequency and severity and start to either consume up ridiculous amounts of time or create compulsive behaviours (including cognitive ones) in an attempt to reduce the anxiety. For example. I used to spend several hours a day imaging by death, I would constantly have sick compulsions towards people in business meetings, I would check my email several hundred times per day and would check my wallet and the contents around 25 times per day - all of this created great anxiety for me - including panic attacks, hence I was disagnosed by my psychiatrist with OCD. I have had extensive therapy and take seroquel and paxil for it and Im doing ok for now. Now, forgetting anxiety disorders for a moment, many people have what is called "personality traits". These are often key features of personality that lead to a style of thinking - with some pros and some cons. Obsessive/Compulsive personality trait is one such trait, and it wouldnt be uncommon for someone with this type of personality to suffer from obsessive thoughts during a depressive episode, and not actually have OCD at all. Hope this helps a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grousemouse Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 that's awesome info chimpmaster. thanks. grouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dweii Posted February 23, 2006 Author Share Posted February 23, 2006 I'm not sure whether this causes impairment in my life. It sure is disturbing. But I don't want another diagnosis! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myrkkyhammas Posted March 8, 2006 Share Posted March 8, 2006 woah woah woah. what the hell. intrusive thoughts are NOT normal. the normal people i've asked about them have responded with the "where did that second head come from?" look. anyway, i'm bipolar, not OCD, and i get horribly violent intrusive thoughts fucking constantly. listening to black metal helps. really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TruthSeeker Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 Alright, I decided to stop reading this thread and just post because the things people are saying are just giving my subconscious more material to work with. Yes, I definitely get intrusive thoughts, many similar to the ones people described. Hurting myself or others physically, among other disturbing things. In the beginning of the thread, people were trying to decide if this is normal. I'm not sure if it's been discussed since then, as I stopped reading the thread. I can tell you with much certainty that it is NOT normal. I don't mean that it's abnormal, per say, but that normal people with perfectly balanced brains don't experience the same thing. It's normal within the condition (OCD). If others do have a sudden thought that pushes its way into their mind, and it is disturbing, it's almost always something they have visually seen. In a horror film or whatnot. They're just remembering it. We create the images ourselves. Theirs are very rarely as extreme and intense as the ones we receive, and do not invoke the thought of "Oh my god I'm such a sick person" but more "Oh my god that is so sick and I don't want to see it again" or "I really hope that never happens". And then they make it go away. And they know it won't happen. We can't do that. I've been getting them since I was a kid, and it wasn't until after I diagnosed myself with OCD in 8th grade that I learned they are a large part of the disorder, and I wasn't just a sick freak. For reasons unknown, for the past year or so they almost always come when I'm trying to visually picture something that is written in words. As in, when a scene is described in a book. I think it might be because I've learned to somewhat tolerate the strictly random ones, but these really get to me because I can't keep reading until I get rid of the thought and I can't get rid of the thought until I stop obsessing about it and I can't stop obsessing about it because my brain is not chemically balanced. I'll keep replaying the scene over and over again, trying to make it work the way it was described, and it only gets worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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